VED's - Vacuum Erection Devices

[NewlyDxd]

If there is no plaque, can I still use a VED to fix my downward curve?

[Hawk]

Newly, welcome to the forum.  Take a deep breath and unstress.  You have found support to help you through this challange.

If you have Peyronies Disease, and you have developed a downward curve, you do have plaque.  Plaque is scar tissue.  It is what causes a Peyronies Disease curve or bend.  Many men do not have palpable plaque, meaning it is not raised up plaque that you can feel with your fingers. It is never the less plaque.  

Cautious, slow, progressive VED use is appropriate for any Peyronies Disease as long as there is no discomfort during use.

[Angus]

"....my longtime gf and I decided to start having sex a while ago - she eventually confessed that the shape of my penis (downward curving) sometimes made sex uncomfortable.  

I did a search on Ebay for some VEDs and there are some for about $100, but I can't be sure whether they're legit medical devices or I'm getting scammed...

EDIT:  It's the Encore brand and it's being sold from a medical device store, tho it's "OTC".. it comes with 4 cylinders"...

Newly, welcome to the board. What Hawk says is true... you may now relax. Please encourage your gf to visit, read and JOIN the For Women Only section of this board. There are amazing, informed women there that have answers and information for her there. She could go there and get some information about solutions. There are solutions to just about every situation.
  I did go to Ebay and look at the Encore units. They appear to be decent enough units... hopefully someone else here knows more about their quality. An electric unit isn't absolutely necessary. You mention that it comes with 4 cylinders... I saw only one cylinder on the units that I looked at. They did, however, come with four sized restrictor rings that are used by men that are unable to sustain an erection for intercourse. These are not used for Peyronies Disease therapy. Maybe you were confusing rings and cylinders. With that being said, multiple cylinder VED's are used by many for Peyronies Disease therapy and there are many posts here on the subject.
  There is much information on the board about VED choices, assembling your own VED from purchased parts, and making your own VED. And, I hope your gf joins the Women Only board, then you two could double team the condition. There is nothing that the two of you can't overcome... but some reading and discussion will have to take place. When the two of you have questions, ask away... you're with an outstanding bunch of people here.

[not9inches]

Hey guys...im back. I have to tell you folks who have helped me...that Ive not been using the VED regularly. I guess thats for two reasons. 1)  my unit is still about the same as in the pic i posted...and i have no problem getting/keeping an erection. And sex is not a problem. I can actually grab my unit...squeeze just right and straighen it out some for easier penetration.  2) i tried the small cylinder. What is sooooooo wierd to me is as im pumping...my unit fills the chamber ( thickness) and feels like its squashed. Is this where you should pump just a bit more and begin to stretch outward. I guess i need to talk to one of you guys on the phone. I could explain better what im thinking. Anyway...ive not been doing much VED physical therapy cause im still able to perform. But i thinks i should be doing it.

By the way...the other day while in the shower,....i was stretching my unit in the flacid state...feeling for hardness,....and sure enough...i can feel it now. Its down deep in the core it feels like. Ive been feeling near the surface and thats why i could not feel any hardness.  Ive been squeezing it with my thumb and fore finger to try and soften it.  HHhmmm i'll try anything.  

[ComeBacKid]

Not9inches,

When I first started ou with the soma in May, it felt so weird I put it away for a few months, now I'm on week 20 of the protocol and I look forward to getting home from work, turning on the tube, and pumping for awhile.  Its integrated into my daily schedule.  I'm back in the A cylinder this week, haven't been in it for awhile, my unit doesn't go very far lengthwise in the tube cause it fills it up right away, from what I understand this is ok, you don't want to pump it lengthwise and force it to strech further through pain or anything.  The design was made so that it straightens, not necessarily goes as far lengthwise as what the actual penis could.  Just pump lightly for a few days, after a week you will become accustomed to it.

ComeBackid

[hopeful]

Hey ComeBackid- any benefit from SOMA?

Let me know  Hopeful!

Not9inches,

When I first started ou with the soma in May, it felt so weird I put it away for a few months, now I'm on week 20 of the protocol and I look forward to getting home from work, turning on the tube, and pumping for awhile.  Its integrated into my daily schedule.  I'm back in the A cylinder this week, haven't been in it for awhile, my  

[gibson101]

Greetings

is using the soma only advicable in the stable stage of Peyronies Disease? Im still in the early stage but size decrease is already noticable? Can anyone here give me some kind of guide?Could you doo more damge while still in the innitial stages?

Regards

[ComeBacKid]

The short answer is yes some benefit, I will be posting a progress report when I complete the 26 week protocol if I'm able to, otherwise I will only be able to complete up to week 22, I'm going to be going away for a little, but I'll be back, its good to get a break from this mess for sure.  Look for my progress report when I post it under VED's in the future, I will include some measurments and things I notice in detail.  Hopeful if I were you and didn't want to shell out the $$$ for a VED I'd build my own, there seems to be some promise with stretching the tunica.  You can trust me my friend you know I won't blow smoke up your ass like some doctors in florida- no names mentioned.

ComeBackid

[Hawk]

is using the soma only advicable in the stable stage of Peyronies Disease? Im still in the early stage but size decrease is already noticable? Can anyone here give me some kind of guide?Could you doo more damge while still in the innitial stages?

Gibson, the truth is you CAN always do more damage, but the VED is useful in the beginning (acute) stages.  
Angus has performed a priceless service by building highlights of all our key topics so newcomers and the rest of us can get the meat of past discussions on every topic without having to wade through every post.  It is still a work in progress and represents a ton of dedicated work.  I think it will ultimately be the greatest collection of patient information ever available from any source and a huge contribution to the Peyronies Disease community.  That is what we came here to build and the members (real patients) with years of experience, supplied the information.  The VED section is complete. Click here and check it out. https://www.peyroniesforum.net/index.php/board,18.0.html

That section is read only for review of information.  You must come back here for actual discussion.  Keep in mind that the "Just Diagnosed" section reads from the top down, opposite of the rest of the forum.

[gibson101]

Hawk thank you for your response. I know I can not rely fully on what is said here but do you think it is advicable for me to give VED a try. I am unable to get a erection at the moment and I do believe that most of it is due to the fact that my mind is a mess. I have slept about 10 hours in a week and am hardly eating. Began with Vit E and Acetyl L-Carnitine  yeaterday but as everyone seems to say the results are rearly helpfull.

What are the dangers of using VED? I know if you over do it but how will you know what is too much or too little?I didnt feel any pain when i did my damage to myself so how would you know with a VED? Im sorry if some of my questions seem silly. I read over the lik you sent me and obviously for some people it has worked bbut I dont know if theres was as serious as mine.. i.e. hardening of whole penis.

Regards

[Hawk]

Gibson,

I feel for you and understand you want fixed and want it now.  You at least want some assurance that the path you set out on will help improve your condition, or at least keep it from getting worse  The truth is, that there is not a legitimate doctor in the world that can promise you that with any treatment even after a full examination.  Remove the examination, and remove the medical expertise, and only a total nut job would assure you it will work.

As you read and study the information here, you will know as much as we do.  As you apply it to your situation, you will know more about your Peyronies Disease than we do.  You must embark on a plan as you have with the Vit E (which I have little confidence in) and the ALC which I have more confidence in.  You need to learn to read your body.  You will know if you are getting better by things like curve, erection, and pain.  If it hurts, don't do it.  

Very often Peyronies Disease is not the result of an injury.  It is a fibrotic condition set off by a cascade of conditions that are only partly understood.  Read the highlights of each topic (at the link I provided).  Pick out what you are willing to invest time in and money on and put together a plan of action for you.  Most agree that prescription pentox, and Viagra, along with over-the-counter arginine shows most promise.  Some as honest, and experienced, and as sincere feel the VED is a better choice.  

These are the tools.  You must choose and tackle your project.

PS: I would be very interested in why you are not sleeping or eating since this will offset much of the good you can do to help yourself psychologically and physically.  Please post about that under our "Psychological" topic.

[NewlyDxd]

Hey Guys,
So I visited the website that Tim (?) had posted on where to buy your own cylinders and went ahead and decided to make my own.  It came out to less than $200, which is a lot less than the Soma was gonna cost me.  I'll let you know how I make out.

Newly

[Liam]

Has anyone bought one of the cheap VEDs from Ebay?  How do they work?  If they are not too bad, they might let someone without insurance get started.  Granted, they are not the Rolls Royce of VEDs.  But, they might get you from point "A" to point "B".

[not9inches]

I have a question for anyone. Ive posted here before. Ive wondered if anyone has tried squeezing/massageing
the plaque/scar tissue area of thier unit. sort of roll it between thumb and forfinger...to  soften it. Ive been doing
this as it is a simple/easy thing to do while in the shower. I do thiss because it seems to make sense that
over time it may break it down. Any ideas? Anyone been doing this or tried it? and No....im not pulling or stretching
out my unit.

[Liam]

Squeezing may cause trauma which may facilitate the onset of new plaque or scar tissue.  


Or not.  The jury is out on this.  I've heard a case made for each point of view.  Both seem plausible.  Proceed with caution.

Sorry no definitive answer from me.  I'll let Tim and others weigh in.

Liam

[Rico]

I know some veterans think that 30 minutes holding the ved for two to three times a day seems to be a bit much.... I found this interesting with Levines post on this topic on the apda site.... I think it is good that he is documenting his findings and will follow up with more, a report on the subject along with the pentox ect....

He also said there is no human facts on pentox and peyronies, I found this strange since Lue has written on it with one study with a 51 year old man, but maybe this isn't enough to say there has been a study other than rats....

Rico

[ComeBacKid]

Rico,

I also found Dr. Levines comments about pentox to be strange since there is a study out on it.  I agree with him though on the theory of holding the VED, but I wouldn't do it for 30 minutes and I doubt many would have the patience to do so either.  I'd start out at 5 or 10 mintues and work up to 15 mintues or so.  I'd hold for 15 minutes and then release and left the penis go back down to flaccid state for about 5 mintues, and do this cycle three or four times, thats just me personally.  It is like braces on teeth when you think about it, I've been thinking about that for the past few months actually.  It also sounds LIke Dr. Levine is saying the penis extenders have resulted in increased lenght on his patients who haved used them... but not available study for a few more months.  

[Liam]

I have heard the VED permanently weakens the erection, so I wouldn't try that.

Where have you heard this?  Since I was prescibed a VED by my urologist, any reliable information would be appreciated.

Liam

[tdsc]

Liam-

I wish I kept the website where I found it.  I remember that it was a doctor, who used the VED twice, under normal pressure.  He remarked that it alters the erectile bodies, and in his case, permamently causing a less rigid erection.  He also said that this was common in others who used the VED.  The only other thing is that I talked to somebody on the biospecifics board who started the VED and he felt his erections were weaker.  

[Liam]

Re: Progression of Peyronie's Disease
« Reply #292 on: Today at 01:29:40 AM » Quote Modify Remove Split Topic  

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Liam-

I wish I kept the website where I found it.  I remember that it was a doctor, who used the VED twice, under normal pressure.  He remarked that it alters the erectile bodies, and in his case, permanently causing a less rigid erection.  He also said that this was common in others who used the VED.  The only other thing is that I talked to somebody on the biospecifics board who started the VED and he felt his erections were weaker.

TDSC,

My concern is that the VED is used to "treat" ED or Peyronies Disease or some other dysfunction.  Structural changes are already taking place, at least from Peyronies Disease.  If there weren't, most people wouldn't use it.  Also, having used the VED for over a year now, I find it hard to believe, not impossible, a less rigid erection could be caused by using a VED correctly two times.  It is even harder to believe two time could cause a structural change.

As far as the person on the forum, he may be right.  He started using a VED and his erections were getting weaker.  I would attribute the weaker erections to the condition for which he was using the VED and not the VED itself (correlation vs. causation).

Without condemning, sometimes people "think out loud" on a forum.  You can't always believe what you read.  This is more true for discussions of penis enlargement and the like.

Please understand, while I am questioning the ideas, I am not questioning you.  I had never heard these comments and I'm glad you posted them for discussion.

Thanks

Liam

[Tim468]

Please remember that there are two published case reports of a VED causing Peyronies Disease. In one case, the man (who did not have ED or any other problem apparently) used extremely high pressures. I think he used pressures that were over 10-20 times the highest acceptable limits of vacuum pressure. I can go (speaking for myself) above the higher recommended pressure limits of 10 mm Hg (on Wikipedia), which is nothing in terms of vacuum, IMO. In the second case, a man had used the VED complication-free for four years before deveoping Peyronies (which seems to argue against causation IMO).

My thinking is that one can expect to see microvascular damage if the vacuum pressure exceeds too far beyond normal blood pressure limits. By "limits" I mean the outer limits of physiological pressures in blood vessels. Thus, if a arterial/capillary/venous system can accomodate upwards of 200/100 blood pressure, I should be able to apply a vacuum pressure of negative 200 mm Hg (which are the units used in measuring BP) without any profound damage.

OTOH, pressure sores can develop in skin from prolonged periods of lying in bed, and those pressures are estimated to be on the order of 30-40 mm Hg pressure, but over a prolonged period of time (ie four hours)!

So I think the likelihood of damage to tissue or structures comes from a combination of TIME and PRESSURE. If one leaves a penile extender on for too long without taking a break to allow for good blood flow to the areas where the lassoo is applied, then damage to the skin there can occur. If extremely high pressures (on the order of 2000 mm Hg) are applied to a vacuum, damage can occur.

The thirty minute rule has come from the ED treatment guidelines as to how long to leave a tourniquet in place for maintaining an erection. After thirty minutes, they recommend releasing the tourniquet and waiting a bit, and then reapplying the VED and tourniquet if more intercourse is desired. That seems reasonable for avoiding vascular damage from a lack of new replenishing blood flow to the normal penis.

In Peyronies disease, there are several different issues. First of all, it is not maintaining an erection for uninterupted sex that is desired. Rather it is to stretch out contracted tissue, and to continue to nourish it to promote healing. All the data on tissue expansion suggest that good enough blood flow is vital to allow for it to gradually stretch out over time. But the data also suggest that a certain TOTAL amount of time of stretching is vital to promoting true changes.

Though I am not sure where in the hell I could fit it in my day, it would probably be better to do a strech for 30 minutes twice daily. Those thiry minutes could be broken down into 2-5 minute bits, with a brief break (ie 10 seconds) to allow for new blood flow to the tissue, followed by a reapplication of the vacuum. I see no reason that the thirty minutes of stretching needs to be continuous (as it does during intercourse) to promote overall changes in tissue shape.

Tim

ps
Here are the links to the case reports of damage done by the VED

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=8558654&dopt=Abstract

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=4738585

[Rico]

Mr. Dillion:

Thanks for the update and good news:).... I moved this over to the VED side...

I was wondering on your improvement of 15 Degrees... does this also mean you have gained back lost size and did you have hour glass also and had this improved?  

Once again I'm happy for your success....

Rico

[bardo]

Is there any discussion on these threads about locating VED's at a good price? I am interested in the Soma Correct as it appears to have had a reasonable amount of validation in this forum. I live in the UK so I'm not even sure whether there's a distributer here. I have located it in a few US-supplied suppliers but the price seems to vary considerably. $350 is the cheapest I've seen so far. Is that good? I'm happy to import if that's the best thing to do. Thanks for all the info in these forums - I'm very impressed at how well the vast number of posts have been organised. I wondered whether a thread or threads devoted to sourcing treatments had been considered since the cost of many of them can be quite prohibitive.

[Old Man]

bardo:

There are sources of the Soma products in the UK. However, I do not have the exact name, location and other particulars. You can contact the manufacturer of the Soma products at their home office location in Augusta, GA, USA. Their web address is: www.augustams.com

There are other sources in the USA that carry the follow on product to the Soma Correct which is the Somaerect STF. The Soma Correct is no longer sold as I understand it.

There have been several guys asking about the Soma products in the UK and Europe, so maybe one them can help you if they read your post.

Old Man

[Mister Dillon]

Just to follow up on a discussion that has moved from the Urologists and Other Doctors thread.

I have not seen any improvement in size or hourglass yet but the improvement in degree of bend is keeping me going. (over 15 degrees to date)  I have been using the Spivery Protocol (http://www.vacuumtherapy.org/extras.html) for about 3 months now but perhaps I will increase the number of cycles and hold them a bit longer after reading some of the recent posts here.

Mister Dillon  

[Steve]

That's great news Mr Dillon!  Unfortunately, it hasn't been the magic bullet for me yet  I've been using the Soma for about 30weeks now, with no discernable change in angle or hourglass...bummer.  I'm going to prepare a 'report' for the forum when my work load lightens up some.

Also concerning the Soma, some time back, someone mentioned the re-designed sizing rings that were changed to reduce the pinching that could occur between the ring and tube.  I emailed Augusta asking about those rings, and got a nice voice mail (I was away from my phone) from a representative who said that they're sending out a package with the new rings free of charge.  I remember some of the initial discussions on the forum were that they should make them free for previous purchasers, and it looks like they have.  Thanks Augusta.

Steve

[misterb]

Guys, I have a traction device on the way and will begin treatment as soon as it arrives. I'll periodically update you on the progress.  

[Rico]

misterb:

I know you have been going to Dr. Levine, did he recommend the traction over the VED? Do you have a hour glass also, or just bend and lost of size?

How is the pentox working for you? Did Dr. Levine say how long you should take the pentox for?

Thanks in advance for the information....

Rico

[Tim468]

I have not seen any improvement in size or hourglass yet but the improvement in degree of bend is keeping me going. (over 15 degrees to date)

Interesting. I am not sure I have the words to explain how I think this works physiologically, and my attempts at ASCI art are so-so. But... it seems from my personal experience that when a vacuum is applied in a smaller than average tube, that there is a longitudinal traction applied to the penis that exceeds the lateral forces applied to the surface. In keeping with that, I have seen a small improvement of about 5 degrees in the curve, but no change in the dents I have. Also, I note that in the larger cylinder that from how it *feels*, it does not seem like the increased room (which allows for unconstrained expansion in diameter) does not feel as "stretchy" on the dented areas, as the tugging on the end feels when I apply vacuum in the smaller diameter cylinder.

With a lot of lubrication, then, and moderately high vacuum pressures, in the smaller tube there is mostly a lengthening force that is applied (based on how it looks and feels), and it makes sense to me that this would affect the bend the most. In the larger tube, there is more "filling to the sides" pressure available (because there is more room), but it does not feel like it has nearly the amount or quality of force as I feel tugging me lengthwise.

Tim

[misterb]

He suggested I try the traction device. I wouldn't go so far as to say he recommends one over the other, I believe he makes a determination based on each individual's set of circumstances as any good physician should. What began as a slight indentation on the left side only has progressed and now I'm slightly indented on both sides. I'm not sure I would call it a true hourglass deformity just yet. I lost only a little size but I am already significantly lacking in that department so even a small loss is a very big deal. I hope the traction device will help me gain it back and then some. I had to stop taking the Pentox, it gave me terrible heartburn even when taken with food.  

[Tim468]

I wonder if one could take perfenidone instead of pentox and get the same benefit. Perfenidone is currently being studied for idiopathic pulmonary fibrosis here (for it's TGF inhibiting qualities) - I wonder if it is possible to get it for Peyronies Disease?

Tim

[jwelw]

I am new to all of this, and am considering trying the Soma Correct. I would appreciate it if anyone could help me with the following questions:
1) I entered soma correct on Google and don't get much information on it. Is there a website that explains the details of its use before purchase so I can have a better idea of what it exactly entails? The Augusta site has little information on it that I can find.
2) I spoke with one urologist who maintains that you should do iontophoresis with verapramil before using the Soma to soften the plaque, otherwise it could be harmful. Yet I don't notice anyone on this site mentioning anything about this. It makes sense to me to soften the plaque before stretching. Can anyone give me their thoughts and experience on this matter?
3) Does anyone have any positive experience with iontophoresis? I don't see much mention of it here.

Many thanks for any help.

[Steve]

Tim,

I've noticed the same 'feeling' when using the smaller cylinders...the stretch is more lengthwise.  I've been through the 26 week protocol, with no change that I can detect/measure in the angle (my biggest concern) or indentations.  Because of this, I've gone to using only the 2 smaller cylinders for a while to concentrate on stretching the length and trying to straighten out some bend.

Steve

[Angus]

I am new to all of this, and am considering trying the Soma Correct. I would appreciate it if anyone could help me with the following questions:
1) I entered soma correct on Google and don't get much information on it. Is there a website that explains the details of its use before purchase so I can have a better idea of what it exactly entails? The Augusta site has little information on it that I can find.
2) I spoke with one urologist who maintains that you should do iontophoresis with verapramil before using the Soma to soften the plaque, otherwise it could be harmful. Yet I don't notice anyone on this site mentioning anything about this. It makes sense to me to soften the plaque before stretching. Can anyone give me their thoughts and experience on this matter?
3) Does anyone have any positive experience with iontophoresis? I don't see much mention of it here.

Many thanks for any help.

Welcome to the board, jwelw. Lots of information is available for you here. If you haven't already done so, check out the Newly Diagnosed section of the board for condensed information for a quick overview.
  There are many men here with experience with the multi-cylinder VED therapy. It is basically the use of small, medium and large size cylinders with a vacuum pump to help stretch and re-model a curved penis. Details of the 26 week protocol can be found at www.vacuumtherapy.org. Many questions, thoughts and ideas concerning this are addressed in the VED thread. The board has a very good "search" function that helps find specific subjects among hundreds of posts. There are members here that have used iontophoresis as well as the VED. Multi-cylinder VED use helped improve my condition. Varied results are reported with VED therapy, with many success stories reported here.  

[ComeBacKid]

I am new to all of this, and am considering trying the Soma Correct. I would appreciate it if anyone could help me with the following questions:

2) I spoke with one urologist who maintains that you should do iontophoresis with verapramil before using the Soma to soften the plaque, otherwise it could be harmful. Yet I don't notice anyone on this site mentioning anything about this. It makes sense to me to soften the plaque before stretching. Can anyone give me their thoughts and experience on this matter?

Jwelw, would that doctor be Dr. Carrol from Orlando, Florida?  I was told the same thing by his assistant, although I ignored that adviced and have been stretching on the protocol now for 6 months.  I've gained some size back although only in the flaccid state.  The last 5 weeks I started taking the pentox and noticed an increase in flaccid size, and my erections were also more full. My bend has remained the same and my plaque has not seemed to lessen at all.  The ved clearly increased my flaccid size, whether it was permanent or temporary I do not know since I have not stopped pumping yet.  The pentox clearly increased flaccid size and made my erections more full, I'm plan to continue taking the pentox. Currently I'm still pumping about once every other day or 3 days and have seen results.  I originally tried the iono before starting to pump way back in the summer, I did a treatment everyday for a month and saw no results, I spent well over one thousand dollars for the machine, medicine, and pads.  A few months ago Dr. Carrols office called me and wanted me to buy more iono treatments claiming that if you do the ved without first softening the plaque you can make your condition worse.  I said no thanks and kept pumping anyway, my plaque has definately not gotten worse, thats for sure.  Hope this update helps some.

ComeBackid

[bob]

On a separate but related topic, is anyone aware if there are smaller-sized inserts of some sort for the Osbon Esteem manual VED? The cylinder seems kind of big. Even the late John Holmes wouldn't have been able to fill its diameter.

[jon]

On a separate but related topic, is anyone aware if there are smaller-sized inserts of some sort for the Osbon Esteem manual VED? The cylinder seems kind of big. Even the late John Holmes wouldn't have been able to fill its diameter.

Dunno if there are inserts, but Tim has posted links to a couple sites which give you everything you need to make your own pumps at home. One site which sells a vacuum pump w/ a gauge on it, and another which sell multiple sized cylinders with diameters ranging from 1.5" thru 3". Shipping included, for a 1.5" cylinder + the pump, has only cost me ~80USD. The cylinders are about $55 each, so to create a VED system to achieve similar results as the Soma Correct models should run you no more than $200.

[Tim468]

Gee, I dunno.. I found that 3 inch tube sort of confining... Thank God it was a foot long!

Tim  javascript:void(0);
Wink

[Old Man]

Bob:

Look for a PM from me relative a source of sizing inserts for the Osbon Esteem VED.

Old Man

[bob]

Thanks and I do appreciate the humor.

(You were joking, Tim, right? I mean, Peyronies Disease is bad enough...) Speaking of humorous, did you check out the graphics on the site VacuumTherapy.org? On the "Extras" page, which I suppose is all about cylinders, the stock photo they use is of a ... sprocket.

I mean, ouch.

[jwelw]

Thanks to Old Man and others who have responded to my questions about Soma and iontophoresis. It's nice to know that there is help and support out there. Yes, it was Dr. Carroll who recommended softening the plaque before using the Soma. From reading through the thread, it doesn't seem that iontophoresis does much, so i will probably forego that. Before trying to buy and use the Soma, which still seems a little daunting to me in terms of time commitment and figuring the whole thing out,  I think I will try the easier things, like enzymes and Vitamin E and dmso. Has anyone had any good results from dmso and serum copper? Again, I appreciate the help, and will get back to you again on this when I try the VED.  

[Hawk]

Jwelw,

I certainly would not call DMSO less daunting than a VED.  

[tdsc]

jwelw- I read off of a copper peptide skin forum that overuse of copper peptides can turn the copper peptide into a pro-oxidant, with the result sagging, loose skin.  They say that the metal ligands in the copper complex can be damaging, so I would be hesitant to use something like this without further research.

[NewlyDxd]

Hi,

Im having trouble keeping a good "seal" at the base of my penis with my ved... air seems to always get out at the base, so i cant hold the pressure for too long... any suggestions??

[Tim468]

I have developed the habit of shaving just a tad. There are a few hairs that seem to grow on the shaft right near the base, and of course that hair that is in the normal distribution. I shave on the upper side of the shaft (facing you as you look down) about 1/4 inch, and for about the same amount on the sides. The "bottom" of the shaft (the balls side, if you will!) has less hair, but I also shave there. I do all of this when I am in the shower, and I do not do it just before using the VED (I will spare you the story of how freaked out I was when I took the pump off and found blood!).

Secondly, we have talked about using good lubricants. Some have used shaving cream for lubrication; I use a standard bedroom lubricant and it works fine. I also sort of prefer multi-tasking, so I will pump in the bathtub, and have found that soaping up works well too (but the bath has to be shallow enout to be above water level when pumping). No matter what you use, a good seal will be better without hairs breaking the seal, and with wet or slick conditions. Finally, if you are trying to use a larger sized cylinder and losing your seal or getting your testes sucked up into the cylinder (ouch), then one can use a cylinder that is larger diameter, but allows for a sort of gasket to be placed on the base of the cylinder - to allow a smaller diameter right there. I am at work, so will have to pass on forwarding the links!!!

Tim

[Tim468]

Here is a link to an insert (for the Osborn Esteem model), but it shows how one could use the VED with an insert to reduce the diameter right at the opening, make it more comfortable, and reduce leak (not to mention indrawing of skin and other parts).

Tim

http://www.timmmedical.com/cart/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=3

[Hawk]

For those that are looking for a one cylinder design, there is a system tht is very different.  it is the Vacurect.  http://www.vacurect.com/howitworks.htm

Advantages:
One handed operation once it is in place
Very compact and less obtrusive and awkward to transport or in intimate situations for erections
Far less lubricant required
Retaining ring is in place, comfortably on the penis before you ever begin to pump.  They don't snap on to your penis.
The retaining rings (really more like flat washers) work great just as "cock rings" to help an erection without the VED
10 different sized rings.  The largest can be used almost like a "no-ring system" if you are not exceptionally large
Sells for $200.00

Disadvantage:
No release valve - I don't see this as a problem since most know it is easy to cause a slow or fast leak in an air tight seal.
one cylinder size

[JAKE52]

I am very grateful for all of you have made recent posts on the the topic of VEDs. From what I read here, only "Old Man" after many YEARS of therapy feels it has really made an improvement. The rest of us are just hopeful. Mist all the links to the literature I read on all the comepting expensive products have no proven track record in improvinf Peyronies Disease (or at most a single sponsor with no duble-blind study). While I am unconvinced spending $400-$600 for a prescription device will produce better result than the $45 adult store variety, I yield to the advice of all of you here who have seemingly done far more extensive research and have actually tried various devices. I have 30 days before my cureent medical insurance runs out to make a decision. I would greatly appreciate the benefit of your advice of the three products I am considering for which I can get get partial insurance reimbursement.  A) The three cylinder SOMA VED (Bar far the most expensive and most confusing, B) SOMA's one cylinder mode, and C) the OSBORN VED (the least expensive at about $400).  While desparate, I also don't want't to be taken to the cleaners by purchasing another unproven miracle cure.  Your simple "1-2 liner" feedback would be most appreciated.
(For what it's worth, I'm 9.5 inches down to 3.5 inches in length with a 5 inch bash tapering to a 1 inch hourclas left bend with plague in both tubes, and the goal is ANY improvemnet in length, the hourflass, OR the bend)

[Tim468]

Jake,

Your insurance status may be irrelevant if it will not cover the device. In that case, consider making your own for far less money. Go back through this thread or my old posts to see some links and options that come to less than a third of the Osborn esteem.

Tim

[Angus]

  Welcome JAKE52. There are more of us who have had huge improvement with VED use, including myself. Lots of VED information is condensed into the Newly Diagnosed section in the VED thread. Information from Old Man, Tim568, myself and others is there and you can find information on a useful protocol, buying cylinders and assembling your own, and you can make a safe, entirely workable VED from tube materials, some caps, a bit of epoxy and a hand pump as I did. A VED can be had for less than $30 if you are handy with a few tools. A bit more and you can assemble purchased tubes and hand pumps. If cost becomes an issue, information is available here to put one together for relatively little cost.