Traction

[newguy]

Okay, around one month into my current situation. Backstory is I have had a 30-40 degree curve for many years, long before I was diagnosed or the knowledge that is now out there existed for me to be able to help the problem.

Upon finding this community, initially I was eager to go 'hell for leather', but after heeding warnings here i stuck with/added to med (pentox, acetyl-l-carnitine etc, vit e etc) and added the VED into the mix for a few months, before finally adding stretching. As reported a few posts down, I have somehow injured myself. I can't pinpoint an event, but the pain is down the left (peyronies) side and it makes sense that it was stretching related. I did add manual stretches into the routine too, so maybe it was that. Being that the pressure would be variable???

Changes in the last month. At first erections really died down, coinciding with the pain, no nocturnal erections which wasn't a problem before.. and now a very small nodule (by this I mean it's within the skin, not the penis itself – it moves with the skin).. maybe very slight changes in fibres. Still no nocturnal erections, though the pain is maybe 75% less than it was, angle currently the same as it was pre-pain. I feel and hope that pain will be gone in 2-3 weeks – though I could be wrong of course. I've added Viagra into the mix and this allows time to get very full erections, so i'm going to keep taking it.

My concern is that having already suffered one bout of Peyronies Disease, this could really be devastating. I'm not entirely sure of what to do. On the meds front I have everything covered. I tried the VED yesterday and didn't experience more pain, but i'd rather leave it a few days until the pain went away or subsides a little more to avoid making the problem worse. From a scar tissue point of view,  it would make sense for me to return to VERY gentle stretching at some point soon too I know, but again when and for how long are questions that have no precise answers.

I suppose in the next 2 – 5 months I will start to get an idea of whether I am about to be heading through a hellish time,  or if my early use of meds and ved etc will limit any potential damage. My urologist has been progressively less help, to the point where, if someone can point me towards anyone knowledgable in this area the UK i'd appreciate it.  Though to be honest, i don't really think there is anything they can add to the equation at this stage. Any advice would be appreciated. I'm feeling very upset about all of this and pray that it has a posiive outcome.

[Tim468]

Newguy - frankly, from what you've written, you sound practically home free. I'd lay off any traction, maybe add some ibuprofen to the mix and resume much more gentle traction when your pain is resolved.

Tim

[Crook]

I dont have peyronies but something that is causing a twist and one side of my penis to be bigger than the other, I have had it for about a year and a half now with no or very little improvement, it is definetly not peyronies and I think traction will help, can someone please recomend me a product, I am thinking the jez extender or the X4.
Thanks.

[Tim468]

The traction devices that use a noose are less wonderful than those that use a strap.

IT sounds like you are not sure what you have. Have you gone to a urologist? If one side is larger (and this has led to a bend), then that indeed does not sound like Peyronie's Disease. OTOH, it could be something bad, as the corporal chambers do not enlarge unilaterally after growth is done. To be sure it is not a tumor, or secondary to a rupture in the tunica or something, you need to be evaluated.

Tim

[Crook]

It happened suddenly due to oral sex, it seems like a tear in the fascia or something similar, doctors are baffled and ultrasound doppler returns normal. Seeing as though trauma did it then I'm hoping trauma can fix it, if anything a longer penis never hur... umm... only got something to gain and nothing to lose I guess.

[newguy]

I wouldn't say that trauma as such can fix a problem - it could do the opposite. It depends on the condition, but it's best to look at it from the perspective of a dedicated and moderate approach. I recently had a scare relating to traction/stretching, and am not out of the woods yet. There are a few horror stories on the net relating to over enthusiastic traction causing very real damage. First you should seek further qualified opinion as to what your problem is, and secondly if you do go down the traction route, take a steady and measured approach, rather than thinking that the more aggressive you treat a problem, the faster it will resolve. That is not always the case.

It happened suddenly due to oral sex, it seems like a tear in the fascia or something similar, doctors are baffled and ultrasound doppler returns normal. Seeing as though trauma did it then I'm hoping trauma can fix it, if anything a longer penis never hur... umm... only got something to gain and nothing to lose I guess.

[Tim468]

Crook,


Time for asci art! (see below). If your evaluation was while flaccid, and not erect, then they might have missed a lesion. When flaccid, torn tissue that might separate when erect, might come together and be inapparent to ultrasound.

Tim


Flaccid
                (area of tear)
                    /
-----------------------------
                                       |
                                       |
-----------------------------


Errect


              (area of tear)
                    /
-------------      -------------------------
                                                        /
                                                       /
                                                     /
--------------------------------------

[Crook]

Its noticeable when not erect, and extremely noticeable when semi erect but only sometimes, I don't know what this depends on whether it be temperature or hormones. It is least noticeable when fully erect. I have looked it up extensively and the closest thing I could find is a penile torsion, which I have asked 3 urologists about and they have never heard of the term before, and I don't think it is a penile torsion.
I think the chances of any doctor diagnosing let alone treating my problem is very slim.

[AR]

Sorry to digress, but Tim, just what does asci stand for?  AR

[ocelot556]

AR, it's what they call art formed by keystrokes. I'm sure it stands for something but I don't know what. It's what he did with the penis diagram using hypens and equals signs.

[Tim468]

ASCII (should have two "I"'s) stands for (from "Wikipedia"): American Standard Code for Information Interchange (ASCII), pronounced /ˈæski/[1] is a character encoding based on the English alphabet. ASCII codes represent text in computers, communications equipment, and other devices that work with text. Most modern character encodings — which support many more characters than did the original — have a historical basis in ASCII.

[Crook]

If I had to guess I would say whatever bonds the 3 pieces of the penis together has come apart at a section, has anyone heard of this?

[Tim468]

"If I had to guess I would say whatever bonds the 3 pieces of the penis together has come apart at a section, has anyone heard of this?"

No - except during surgery on purpose.

Could it be that you have something like a mass in the shaft of the penis (could be a clot, or localized swelling, or trapped blood in part of a corpora)? That way, when soft, it would not lose size, and lead to an asymmetry, but "disappear" when erect. You may need, again, to get an uptrasound while erect and soft to get a good idea of what is going on.

Tim

[Crook]

Here is an image to help explain what happened and how it is, that palpable vessel has always been palpable and there is one on the other side, after the truama happened it was actually very visable on erection and was even more palpable, after about 2 months it went away, but pain in that red circle area on erection didnt go away until about a year, so it is pretty complex.

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/112/anoyingandpainfullnw8.jpg

[Crook]

What should I get, the VED or a traction device, I dont have enough for both, I pretty much just need to even things up and I am thinking the VED now seeing as though suction is what caused the damage.

[Old Man]

Crook:

I would recommend the VED over traction if you don't have enough resources to afford both. The traction unit requires more time and effort to use since you would have to "wear" it for several hours a day. There is a site that is posted on the VED topic showing that a three cylinder medical quality VED can be bought for less than $250.00.

Look at the VED topic thread a day two ago, where a link to the Fitzz web site was posted. You can buy the Augusta Vitality OTC single cylinder VED for $119.99 and then add the A & B cylinders for about $49.00 each. This will make up the same VED package as the Augusta Somaerect model that cost $595.00 and requires an RX. The Fitzz site does not require an RX for the OTC model. Free shipping is included at the Fitzz site.

If you log on to the Fitzz site, get their 1+800 number and call them they can give you all the info you need to order on line or place a mail order. The extra cylinders are not listed on their web site, you have to ask the sales rep about them. Be glad to help you with this if you need it.

Old Man

[Crook]

Thanks, but I don't see the add ons under accessories, I am a bit confused, more so because I don't know what these add on cylinders are suppose to do, do I just get this: http://www.fitzz.com/Peyronies-Vacuum-Therapy-Treatment-System-P4484C160.aspx
?

[Old Man]

Crook:

The page that you listed is one way of doing it, but it costs more than the other way. You will need to use the 1+800 number and talk to a sales rep. Ask the person about getting the $119.99 basic Vitality OTC manual model and then add the small A and the medium B cylinders ($49.00 each) to the order. This would make to order just over $220.00 total.

It is only available this way by calling the company rather than buying line. The $299.99 outfit would cost you more. Buying the separate pieces will save the difference, etc.

Let me know if I can help further.

Old Man

[Tim468]

I am now trying out traction, using an "autoextender" device. It has a home made quality which I can live with, but somed very good qualities too. The best aspect is the vacuum tip for attachment to the bars that are used to crank up the tension. This avoids either the noose of the "band" that are found in other models. I also bought a "clamp" type attachment he sells, and like how quickly it goes on and comes off. The jury is still out on how long I will be able to use it at a time.

The (significant) downside is the unbelievably unprofessional manner in which the guy who makes and sells these devices operates. Unanswered emails; cranky flames on a board when I (dared to) ask him why he did not answer; pricing that is downright stupid - example: his "package deal" gives you two setups for "10% off". As the setups differ by which attachment (the clamp or the vacuum head) attaches to the "base", then obviously, buying two bases would be redundant. He sells the combo package with just one base, but charges ten percent less than the total cost of buying to complete setups. Since the base alone coasts about $100, you end up paying more for less - and when I asked why he didn't sell based on the total price of the components that were in the "package deal", he, um, didn't answer. He seems to basically be a hobbyist who does this as a sideline and therefore expects infinite patience and willingness to put up with his unprofessional manner.

His "Vac-Extender" head can be used as an attachment on any major traction device, so one option is for those with something like a Fastsize or similar is to buy just that attachment.

I have not been using it enough to report any results. I see a big difference already though in flaccid hang (better post a period of traction than a pumping session).

Analogy time...  

Traction seems to me like tugging on a zippered sweater lengthwise by the zipper. That part is likely to be gradually stretched, but not a lot. OTOH, the sweater material is not going to be stretched at all.

However, when I use the vacuum it is more like stretching the sweater over a really fat belly - it all gets stretched out!

So I see the lateral stretching of the vacuum as complimentary to the longitudinal stretch of the traction device. Since I have a fairly tight band running the length of my dorsum, that is the part that is stretched by the traction, and the minor dents on the side are not affected at all. The vacuum pulls me out laterally, but exerts less longitudinal stretch (unless I stick to the narrowest cylinder).

So my plan is to start using a slightly larger cylinder (my personal "B" sized cylinder) and to use the traction. Hopefully that will give me the best of all worlds (at least in the strange little corner of the world that experimentally tugs at penises!!)

Tim

[Ptolemy]

Tim, I'm not understanding how this "autoextender" works. I am assuming it replaces the noose or the comfort strap and all else is the same. I'm assuming that the attachment to the head of the penis is based on a vacuum seal. If I've understood correctly, wouldn't the vacuum pressure be a problem to wear for multiple hours per day? I've never been able to get used to the comfort strap so the noose is the only attachment that works for me. I'd sure like to find an alternative so I can use different attachments.

I agree with you on the analog part of your message. I think if used carefully, Traction and VED are very complementary approaches to Peyronies - one for length, one for expansion and blood circulation.

[George999]

Penile Traction Therapy For Treatment Of Peyronie's Disease: A Single-Center Pilot Study

[Tim468]

The vacuum is formed in a small plastic cup. The head of the penis is enclosed in a formfitting silicone rubber cap, that fits, in turn, into the plastic cup. Then a blue silicone sleeve is rolled onto both of them to trap the rubber cap in the plastic cup - it holds on due to a small vacuum.. The silicone rubber cap can go unused, but guys tend to get swollen in the tip as fluid gathers there. The rubber silicone "cap" prevents fuid buildup and allows much longer wear.

I attached a picture. It shows the blue silicone sleeves that roll over the plastic cup, the yellowish colered silicine rubber cap that goes directly on the head of the penis, and the attachment that can be used to connect all of it to a traction device (or it can be worn strapped down to the leg like a side arm!). I find that option more usable for longer term traction (I can wear one into work).

I have attached a picture of this stuff. Also provided is a link to the web page that has a video of it being used (on a fake rubber penis - but still not safe for work!).

Tim

http://www.autoextender.com/instructions.html

[Old Man]

Tim:

Just looked at the video in the link you provided. That device looks it would be much better than the other units that we have seen in the penile extenders.

I am sure that it would be much more comfortable than some I have seen. You do good work!!

Old Man

[newguy]

The autoextender has been popular on the thunderplace forum for quite some time. A forum which has some utterly reckless and crazy ideas and horror stoies, as well as the odd gem such as this one.

[Crook]

Crook:

The page that you listed is one way of doing it, but it costs more than the other way. You will need to use the 1+800 number and talk to a sales rep. Ask the person about getting the $119.99 basic Vitality OTC manual model and then add the small A and the medium B cylinders ($49.00 each) to the order. This would make to order just over $220.00 total.

It is only available this way by calling the company rather than buying line. The $299.99 outfit would cost you more. Buying the separate pieces will save the difference, etc.

Let me know if I can help further.

Old Man

Thanks, I have had a think about it, and I am not convinced I have plaque, although I still feel pain sometimes when I have an erection, I think it is a stretched suspensory ligament. I cant see how a vac will help, I think if anything it might make it worse, so I am thinking traction which I am willing to wear for 6 hours a day after work.
Now looking at the ones that are posted here they dont seem to be able to be adjusted unevenly, I looked at the Jes-extender and each side has a seperate adjuster so I can choose to stretch one side, I sent them off an email to ask if thats possible and I think i will go for it, unless someone here can point me to a cheaper equivilent that I heard existed but I imagine they wouldnt be the same.

[Old Man]

crook:

Just a word of caution about using VEDs and traction - be extremely careful not to use too much tension with either. Overpumping the VED can and will cause further damage. Overextending the tension on traction devices will also cause further complications.

Read all the background posts on both subjects before you finally decide which would be best. There are guys using both together, others using them singularly.

Old Man.

Crook & Crank:  BTW, FYI, it is not necessary to quote a previous post each time you post.  

[Crook]

Thanks, and yea I am gonna be patient with it, I have done a lot of research since my last post and I came across a good site that reviews them and I have decided to go with the X4.

btw here is the link: http://www.enlargementworld.com/top-20-penis-stretchers-and-extenders-reviewed

[Old Man]

crook:

The X4 is good unit. Several guys on the forum are using it. Tim has posted a site that uses a vacuum device as part of the traction unit. Look back over this and other topics/threads to find where a link that explains all about the vacuum piece that works with just about any extender/traction device.

From what I see in the videos that are on that site, looks like it would work better than the noose and sling type attachments.

Good luck on your traction venture.

Old Man

[Old Man]

crook:

Look at reply number 373 below. Tim has posted the link to the unit I mentioned in my previous post. Be sure to look at all the videos they have in their home page on how to use the device.

Old Man

[Crook]

The x4 extender package from UPS has on the description "Adult novelty item" just letting people know.

[Crook]

I just figured it all out and have the correct attachments, I found the comfort strap + foam to be the best option for me.

Now my only remaining problem is that the head of my penis turns cold and blue which is scary and if I loosen it it slips out.

[jackisback]

The x4 extender package from UPS has on the description "Adult novelty item" just letting people know.

You mean on the outside of the packaging for all to see?

[Crook]

The x4 extender package from UPS has on the description "Adult novelty item" just letting people know.

You mean on the outside of the packaging for all to see?

Yes.

[jackisback]

I'm reluctant to think about traction since it's such a time issue, and also I'm pretty skeptical of the lack of decent photo evidence from these websites. However, I'm curious: to those of you who bought the X4, did you get the normal one ($200) or the Peyronie's one ($350).  It looks to me like the Peyronie's one just comes with some vitamin E as its only difference, but I don't know, maybe there is some kind of beneficial structural difference as well.

[bodoo2u]

Crook, I know what you mean about the packaging and privacy issue. A lot of people on the forum think it's no big deal, but when I ordered a traction device less than a year ago the name of the company, which had an accompanying website, appeared on my bank statement. I know the tellers at my bank personally, and a lot of them have nothing better to do than look up that site. So, as I said then, companies that sell traction devices and the like need to do a better job of sending their items in plain wrapping, and using an inconspicuous name when they debit our bank/charge accounts.

Until then we should not purchase from them. Those of us who have been offended should post the names of the offending companies on this site so that we can refrain from buying from them.

Just my .02 (and yes, I stole that from someone on the site  ).

[bodoo2u]

Has traction fallen out of favor on the forum. Whatever happened to the trial study that the Good Peyronies Doctor lent his name to in Chicago?

[Tim468]

He is writing the data up - although I note that this article is a review article and not an apparently peer reviewed article (more scientific and prestigious).

Here it is:

Levine, Laurence A.  Newell, Mark M.
Rush University Medical Center, 1725 W Harrison Street, Chicago, IL 60612, USA. drlevine@hotmail.com

FastSize Medical Extender for the treatment of Peyronie's disease. [Review] [13 refs]

Expert Review of Medical Devices.  5(3):305-10, 2008 May.

Abstract This paper reports on the scientific principles, treatment protocol and initial trial results of the FastSize Medical Extender, a new medical device developed for the treatment of Peyronie's disease and phalloplasty utilizing controlled periodic stretching of the penis; other uses of the device are also mentioned. Initial Institutional Review Boards monitored clinical trials of the device indicate that significant (10-45 degrees ) improvement in curvatures are achievable and that larger scale trials are therefore justified.

The device appears to meet a previously unmet need within the population of Peyronie's disease sufferers for a noninvasive, nonsurgical first-option treatment modality. The device works by holding the penis in a cradle and subjecting it to gentle stretching, the tension being provided by small metal extensions that are added to the cradle frame to provide traction against internal springs. Patient education is minimal for the device, but patient compliance with the extended daily treatment procedure is critical for  significant curvature change. While a review of appropriate reimbursement codes has not been conducted, the pricing of the device makes it easily affordable. Although it has not yet been formally studied, the device also appears to have applications beyond Peyronie's disease; such as offering potential for offsetting penile shortening prior to implant surgery, preventing shortening following Peyronies Disease penile reconstruction and after radical prostatectomy where loss of penile length is commonly reported. The recent trial noted that, over a 6-month period, patients reported increases in penile length of 1-2.0 cm, with an accompanying increase in girth.

There are no alternative devices available that have proven efficacy as a result of a clinical trial and, given reproducible results, the device will begin to play an important role in treatments that require penile tissue remodeling. Future developments should include larger scale, multicenter trials aimed at reproducing the results of the initial study on Peyronie's disease, also trials in conjunction with pharmacological treatment involving plaque remodeling agents such as verapamil and interferon, and trials that will investigate the possible benefits of the device for penile enlargement that may help pre- and postsurgical candidates for penile implants and penile
reconstruction following prostatectomy. [References: 13]

[Hawk]

to those of you who bought the X4, did you get the normal one ($200) or the Peyronie's one ($350).  It looks to me like the Peyronie's one just comes with some vitamin E as its only difference, but I don't know, maybe there is some kind of beneficial structural difference as well.

Sorry to be vague but I did not even know they had a $200 model.  I am sure I have the "Deluxe" (not the Gold Deluxe) but it came with no cream.  Just an extender with the hybrid harness for either the comfort strap or typical noose.  It also came with several extension rods of assorted length and extra foam, nooses, and straps.  It was in the $400.00 range.

Concerning discrete packaging, Mine came with "tool kit" on the package.  I thought it was clever and discrete.  

[bodoo2u]

Tim,

Thanks for the info on Levine. I'm not sure of the study will tell us anything we don't already know. A lot of us have been using traction devices for a while, so we know whether it has been beneficial to us. With me, I think I have regained some girth and prevented any worsening, which is a major accomplishment.

[LWillisjr]

I more thing to add ( since Dr. Levine is my doctor     )

For Peyronie's he doesn't suggest only the Fastsize alone for therapy. His therapy approach is 1. Stretching in conjunction with 2. Oral meds and 3. Verapamil injections.

I haven't seen or can find the study, be he personally told me that he sees an improvment in about 70% of his patients with Peyronie's.

[wayne999]

Has anyone seen this:
phallosan.com/us/referenzen.html

The video apparently has some German urologist who says he has treated 680 patients with curvature using the "Phallosan". ?? Although in the video he points out that long term results are not yet researched, which confirms my own suspicions when reading other peoples posts here about how they lose any gains when using VED/traction after stopping it for a while. And if these strecthing/VED , etc things work so well , why don't more urologists recommend them ?

Also there is a reference for a proposed Peyronies Disease study relating to the above product here (does anyone know if they have done anything with this since 2006?)
phallosan.com/global/pdf/The_journal_of_Sexual_Medicine_2006_77_P-04-230.pdf

[Hawk]

Wayne,

You ask some good questions.  Most of these can be answered by reading all pages of this topic or by going to the child board which contains the highlights of every topic on the forum.  The child board for new forum members is critical reading for those that want to bring themselves up to speed on Peyronies Disease and forum issues.

The video... points out that long term results are not yet researched, which confirms my own suspicions when reading other peoples posts here about how they lose any gains when using VED/traction after stopping it for a while.

I don't think the lack of research and objective studies "confirm" your suspicions or "confirm" anything.  It is just that, a lack of the research and confirmation needed to reach a sound conclusion on way or the other.  Also keep in mind that traction and VEDs were not designed for the limited market of Peyronies Disease.  Peyronies Disease use was an after thought after they were marketed and considered gimmicks for doubling the size of a healthy males penis.  Clearly if Peyronies Disease is intermittently or constantly progressive in an individual then the gains would be lost.  In fact the gains, plus some additional size may be lost.  That in NO WAY indicates they are not useful for treatment.  The same can be said of everything from weight lifting to insulin shots, or flue vaccines.   I have never heard anyone suggest these devices are a cure.  Old Man has been using a VED for decades and I never heard him suggest he needs help carrying his penis around due to continual size gains.  I think a man with Peyronies Disease cannot realistically expect to use one of these devices for 6 months and then sell it on E-bay because he is restored.

And if these stretching/VED , etc things work so well , why don't more urologists recommend them ?

How would urologist know any more about it than you or a dentist would know?  Urologists like all physicians, depend on funded , objective, clinical trials.  Very few have the time, or funds, or interest in becoming researchers on every conceivable product.  Again, as you indicated, such research just does not exist.

Also there is a reference for a proposed Peyronies Disease study relating to the above product here (does anyone know if they have done anything with this since 2006?)

You will find reference to preliminary studies in this topic if you read back or do a search on Levine or study in this topic only.

Hawk
PS: If you need help using search or help finding the child board just ask.

[Old Man]

Hawk:

Good point about my "heavy and extended" penis! No, I do not need any device to help me carry "it" around after the VED therapy. However, I did regain all the lost dimensions due to the many episodes of Peyronies Disease. As most know by now from reading my previous posts that Peyronies Disease struck at an early age, receded and came back with greater symptoms each time.

The VED therapy that helped me with resolving my Peyronies Disease symptoms was cooperation between myself and my urologist. She had experience in VED usage at a VA hospital and suggested it for me. The forum posts have the rest of the story. I am relating this again in order to let others know that the VED and traction therapies do work in most cases. There are a few that it just does not help at all, but IMHO any therapy used during bouts of Peyronies Disease can only make for a healthier state of one's penis.

So, bottom line, I can only say that VED/traction therapy in my book does not provide a viable means for enhancing one's penis size. It just gives one a healthier penis if used on a continual basis. It replaces the nocturnal erections for those of us who no longer can have them due to one reason or the other.

Old Man

[Ptolemy]

I used Traction for 6 months approximately 4 hours a day. Note I have also been using VED, alternating the 3 rings weekly, daily use approx 20 minutes.

Benefits - 1) Size and girth - not back to normal but approx 1/2 way back on size and 100% back on girth. 2) Solved my turtle affect. 3) Improved frequency and quality of nightly erections. 4) Improved bend from 90 degrees to 45 degrees when fully erect- enough that I could have intercourse again.

Concerns - 1) Not convenient. Wearing a metal object is a pain. 2) Head of penis was showing some wear - purplish around the edges but no loss of feeling.

Hernia operation and rotator cuff surgery caused cut back/termination after 6 months of use. Use slowed to about zero on some days and about an hour per day on other days. Turtle affect back and some loss of size but not all. Bend improvement remained. Intercourse continues to be possible.

VED is easier maintenance IMO.

[Tim468]

Phallosan does not get rave reviews at Thundersplace dot org (you should consider joining to be able to read there). I bought one (different brand) I like, but I have not incorporated it into a daily routine. IT is made by MonkeyBar who you can chat up at that web site. Caveat emptor - he is quite unprofessional and it will take you forever to get a device!

Tim

[joe]

Ptolemy,

It's nice to hear you had good results with the traction and VED.  I haven't tried either, but was thinking of trying the VED.  Do you think you would have had the same results with the VED alone, or do you think that traction helped more to restore the size & girth?

Joe

[Ptolemy]

Joe, the Traction made a difference because I was using VED for a year before trying Traction. I simply added Traction on top of daily VED use. During the year with VED alone, I was in the "very slow" plaque growth phase. Even with Traction I believe the "very slow" growth continued. Approx 3 months back I added Pentox (Trental) and pretty much stopped caffeine. I believe the plaque growth has stopped but 3 months is a little soon to tell for sure.

With Traction and VED resulting in less bend, I was able to start having intercourse again.

[wayne999]

I used Traction for 6 months approximately 4 hours a day. Note I have also been using VED, alternating the 3 rings weekly, daily use approx 20 minutes.

Benefits - 1) Size and girth - not back to normal but approx 1/2 way back on size and 100% back on girth. 2) Solved my turtle affect. 3) Improved frequency and quality of nightly erections. 4) Improved bend from 90 degrees to 45 degrees when fully erect- enough that I could have intercourse again.

Concerns - 1) Not convenient. Wearing a metal object is a pain. 2) Head of penis was showing some wear - purplish around the edges but no loss of feeling.

Hernia operation and rotator cuff surgery caused cut back/termination after 6 months of use. Use slowed to about zero on some days and about an hour per day on other days. Turtle affect back and some loss of size but not all. Bend improvement remained. Intercourse continues to be possible.

VED is easier maintenance IMO.

Ptolemy,
I was wondering if you could tell us what sort of improvement you had when you used the VED (daily for 20min?) by itself for a year? Your improvement from 90 to 45 degrees sounds terrific, so it would be interesting to see if you felt that was more of a result of the traction therapy?

EDIT: I was looking over some of your posts and it seems that on Feb 20 2008 you said you still saw no improvements in curvature. Did your 90 to 45 degree improvement occur since Feb of this year?(https://www.peyroniesforum.net/index.php/topic,575.msg13235.html#msg13235)

[Ptolemy]

Well Wayne, I spent the better part of an hour crafting a comprehensive reply and when I was in spell check I hit a key that deleted the page. So now all I have time for is a quick summary.

I believe the Traction helped the bend more than VED but that is conjecture on my part. Possibly I would have gotten the same improvements had I never started Traction. There is no way of knowing.

On the timeframe I can't be certain. I have a very patient girlfriend. She has been remarkable with me. She has given me the courage to try intercourse and as I have failed over and over she has been totally supportive. So I kept trying. By June this year I was able to have intercourse and there has been great improvement since. We don't live in the same city so only I see her monthly. Once I started having intercourse I took note of the bend and realized it was much improved to 45 degrees. I can't be certain the bend was 90 degrees in February. Possibly the bend began improving prior to that.

One final note, I began taking Trental on May 15. The area around the plaque seems to be stretching more. I assume the plaque itself does not stretch. I feels to be the same size. Possibly the Trental is helping as well.

[Ptolemy]

...when I'm extended in the Traction device and I feel the shaft, everything is stretching except the plaque. So I would expect to see growth on all sides, ...if you glued a quarter to a tubular balloon and began stretching the balloon repetitively and every so often blowing it up to check the degree of the bend what would be the results?

Ptolemy,

Interesting discussion but I am not signing on to your explanation.  First off, I accept that there could be some logic with blowing up a balloon and stretching the "other tissue" and not the plaque.  The problem is that that example would apply to a single cylinder VED certainly not a traction device that exerts ONLY a longitudinal tension.  Next, if you glued a quarter to a balloon and stretched it, it would have to rip out the glue (or stretch the quarter) before it ever actually put a stretch on the opposite side of the balloon.  Your illustration under-cuts the point you are trying to make.  

It is without controversy that the loss of length in a penis is caused by the plaque.  If it is on one side of a penis rather than diffused, it causes loss of length on one side which equals a curve.  Since the plaque is the short fiber, it is impossible to stretch a penis with plaque to its extent and not engage the plaque because it is the plaque that determins the extent.  If the plaque were not engaged the penis would stretch to its original length.  Since it is engaged, the long side of the penis cannot be stretched before the plaque is stretched.

The blue lines in post 222 cannot be stretched by a longitudinal pull (traction) without stretching the side that is red.  

Levine's lecture and photo series at the AUA conf. bear out this process of straightening resulting in modest length gains, not preceded by length gains.

Hawk, I have gone back and read some of our old discussions. My experience now supports your position that Traction will improve the bend faster than any increase in length improvement. Although I'm using both VED and Traction, and there is no way for me to know for sure which is benefitting me the most, the bend has improved dramatically since utilizing Traction while the increase in length (as measured when I'm engaged in the VED process) has improved only slightly. In other words, my own personal experience supports what Levine is saying about the benefits of Traction when it comes to improving the bend.