ORAL TREATMENTS - GENERAL - Vitamins, Prescriptions , Herbs, Supplements

[ComeBacKid]

I'd recommend getting on pentox immediately if your in healthy condition and have a doctor who will prescribe it.  Right now I'm on just that with a multi vitamin, not all the other junk!  Pentox was proven by Dr. Lue to be effective, and I am once again noticing the positive effects of it.  However, since I have no urologists near me who are willing to work with me and do a doppler ultra sound, I can't scientifically track if plaque is decreasing, or if calcifications are going away.  I also don't know if I have any calcifications or fibrosis.  One thing is for sure the pentox has positive effects including, better flaccid hang (looks like you just got done pumping with a VED constantly)  size gain and straightening when erect, with full solid erections.  And a softer feel when flaccid.  

Comebackid

[despise]

are there anymore suplements that can be useful for peyronies or just the penis? what does fish oil do?

[Iceman]

I'd recommend getting on pentox immediately if your in healthy condition and have a doctor who will prescribe it.  

i agree fully with this

Quote shortened per forum rules - Hawk

[Iceman]

can anyone let me know of any success with ALC + L arginine - I just ordered a whole lot - whats its real purpose in helping with Peyronies Disease - I mean how can these supps help with Peyronies Disease??

maybe Tim can help or anyone who knows a bit more than me.

Thx

[Hawk]

A quick search on the forum or on Yahoo.com etc will give you more info.  A quick and simple answer is that L-arginine is a precursor of nitric oxide (NO).  NO is a vasodilator that relaxes the arteries.  NO binds to receptorss on the artery walls in the penis (an elsewhere) and causes them to relax and allow more blood in.  The same principle is used in nitro tabs or patches for angina pains in the heart.  Also L-arginine is used by bodybuilders to get a pump and deliver nutrients to heavily worked muscles.   Because it relaxes blood vessels caution should be used if you have low blood pressure since it could lower it further temporarily.

Viagra, Levitra, Cialis, all work by preventing the break down of NO so L-arginine helps produce NO and the ED drugs help preserve the NO.

I have forgotten some of the info on ALC but it has been associated with several positive health benefits with few if any problems.  There was one old, small, Italian study that indicated a benefit for Peyronies Disease and many anecdotal stories here, especially for reduction of pain within a week or two.

[slowandsteady]

Here's my current regimen, fwiw:

Boron: 9 mg/day
ALC: 3 g first thing on waking
Serrapeptase: 160,000 units on empty stomach in afternoon
Vitamin D: 7500 IU
Vitamin K2-MK4: substantial, but not actually measured in the supplement
Vitamin A: 5000 IU from cod liver - not synthetic
Vitamin E family: two of the Jarrow FamilE providing 500 mg of gamma tocopherol

Based on George999's thoughts that Peyronies might be primarily autoimmune in nature, I've decided to give boron a try. There is some evidence that boron works to treat arthritis. I'm going to continue this dose for about 3 weeks before backing off. Boron is also involved in calcium regulation. I have a finger with some arthritis pain that I notice when I type. After three days of boron, no pain at the moment. It cuts down on prostate cancer risk too, though for this purpose dosing perhaps at 3 mg from all sources would have the best science behind it.

My vitamin D dosage is based on my measured 25 hydroxy levels, and should get me to about 65 ng/ml.

Vitamin K and A I get from this product. I'm going to try contacting the supplier to see if the quantity of vitamin K2-mk4 has ever actually been measured. I've been influenced lately by Weston Price thinking about vitamin A and synergies among the oil soluble vitamins A, D, K, and E. I'm still trying to form conclusions about optimal dosing and type of vitamin A, since there is a divergence of opinions out there on the subject.

s&s

[Hawk]

Here's my current regimen, fwiw:

Boron: 9 mg/day ....

Boron is not well understood and I think that there has not even been recommended daily allowances set for it.  Much about how it effects mammals is unknown but it does seem to reduce prostate cancer incidence and have some role in blood sugar and calcium levels.   I would think 9mg is kind of high though and at some levels it becomes toxic.

[slowandsteady]

I would think 9mg is kind of high though and at some levels it becomes toxic.

I did write that I'm taking this dosage for three weeks.

From Herb, Nutrients, and Drug Interactions:

Supplemental/Maintenance: The optimal dose of boron for proper physiological function and prevention of osteoporosis appears to be 3 to 6 mg per day.
Pharmacological/Therapeutic: Pharmacological doses used in clinical studies range from less than 1 mg up to 12 mg per day. Administration of 3 mg three times daily constitutes a typical therapeutic dose in the treatment of arthritis. A trial period of 2 to 4 months is usually indicated. Individuals being treated for rheumatoid arthritis will generally report symptom amelioration within 4 weeks of beginning boron supplementation.
Toxic: The potential lethal dose for adults is estimated at 15 to 20 g per day; 150 mg per liter of water represents a toxic concentration of boron.

Breaking up the dosages to match that used for arthritis might have some value.

s&s

[George999]

Very interesting!  - George

[nemo]

Okay, fellas, here's one to inject some freshness in our discussion!  

Besides Peyronie's, which I've lived with for the last 7 years, I also have suffered with a skin condition called Vitiligo for the last year or so.  In my case, this means I have some patches of skin on my face that have lost all their pigment, the melanin just dissapears.  I'd been receiving laser treatment at my dermotologist, but would you believe Vitiligo and Peyronie's have a lot in common - most doctors are woefully ignorant on either.  I could tell my dermo didn't know much and his technician was actually triggering my Vitiligo to get worse by burning me with the laser occasionally (trauma can trigger), so I decided to go to an expert in the field in Los Angeles.  

She's going to try a couple topical agents to help, a steroid cream and a cream that suppresses the immune response in the localized area.  Much like Peyronies Disease, Vitiligo is thought to be the immune system overreacting and killing pigment off in localized areas.  

We started talking about supplements and when I told her I was taking L-Arginine, ALC, and PLC, she said to stop.  She said these amino acids basically mess with the immune system and could be responsible for causing the Vitiligo or making it worse.  I explained that I have Peyronies Disease and these are supps thought to be benificial for Peyronies Disease.  She didn't pursue it any farther, but I know she thinks I should cut these out.

My problem is this - I know these supps have helped my erectile performance - I get nocturnal erections since taking them (along with zinc) that I didn't get for several years.  Frankly, I don't want to stop, especially the Arginine (San Vaso Flow).  

She had an interesting take - she said she sees a lot more men with vitiligo these days and one thing she notices is a lot of men are taking amino acids these days too.  She wasn't making any definitive statements, but she was clearly trying to raise a connection and shadow of doubt.  

My question to George, Tim and anyone else with good working knowledge of such things is what are your thoughts?  The beginning of my vitiligo predated the Arginine by a little bit, but not much.  As I said, I really don't want to stop because of both the potential for helping Peyronies Disease and for the obvious impact these supps have on my erectile quality.   For what it's worth, I'm working with a men's health doctor to address some metabolic issues and what may be adrenal fatigue or even some mild thyroid issues, so I'm trying to take a more global approach.  However, I'd love to hear your thoughts on a link between amino acids triggering a bad immune response.  I thought they worked to suppress that in the case of Peyronies Disease???

Nemo

[ComeBacKid]

Nemo,

Thanks for the information and update on your situation.  I just want to add for everyone that even in the Dr. Lue study, only pentox is used, no l-arginine or ALC, these supplements haven't been study and are kind of unknown.  You don't necessarily need them to treat peyronies, this is another reason I haven't rushed to get back on them.  All these supplements and pills have so many different effects that spider-web through the body, its hard to say A causes B which causes C, its not always that simple to track or monitor.  Even as we take these supplements we aren't properly documenting and tracking information like the doppler ultra sound which would of been great to get one done before my pentox, and a year later and track progress.  We are in a tough spot with this rare disease!  I wonder if they are doing dopplers with the xiaflex study?

Comebackid

[newguy]

I only just realised I'd received an email from Tim concerning my pentox source. I ordered my trental from the http://www.inhousepharmacy.co.uk website. The product isn't featured on the site, but I noticed that the FAQ section states that  enquiries into products not feature on the site are welcome. Thankfully they were could to get hold on it for me. Reviews of inhousepharmacy on online drugs review sites are positive and the site has been online for years, so I feel comfortable with ordering from them. They have a US site here too: http://www.inhousepharmacy.com/

I have searched and can't seem to find the email address of the person I was put in contact with at the company, but if you email them at customerservices@inhousepharmacy.co.uk stating your interest they should be able to get it for you. If you have problems, drop me a PM and I'll try to get to the bottom of it. The last I heard they intended to add it to the site, but that doesn't appear to have happened yet. Maybe because it could be somewhat less popular than many of their offerings?

[George999]

We started talking about supplements and when I told her I was taking L-Arginine, ALC, and PLC, she said to stop.  She said these amino acids basically mess with the immune system and could be responsible for causing the Vitiligo or making it worse.  I explained that I have Peyronies Disease and these are supps thought to be benificial for Peyronies Disease.  She didn't pursue it any farther, but I know she thinks I should cut these out.

For starters, she's right about amino-acids messing with the immune system.  For example, L-Arginine strengthens the immune system and is an essential component of the immune system.  It also is a powerful antifibrotic.  So, like a lot of other things, it is a two edged sword.  For Peyronie's its definitely beneficial despite its dark side.  For the Vitiligo, you won't get anything out of it but the dark side, maybe.  Arginine also promotes cold sores by stimulating the virus that causes it to replicate, go figure.  Nobody really knows all the subtle proclivities and perversities of these things.  However, ALC does just the opposite.  One of its effects, in fact, is to suppress TNF-Alpha and I wouldn't be surprised if it suppressed TGF-beta1 as well.  This is really a great topic and I'm glad you brought it up.  It very clearly demonstrates how everything that is beneficial can also be the enemy.  So, what to do?  I certainly wouldn't quit the ALC, its likely to be beneficial for both.  (I misread the abstract   the abstract indicates that ALC can actually increase levels of TNF-Alpha, although that effect hasn't been seen with oral use.)  As for the Arginine, it may indeed be aggravating your Vitiligo.  So it becomes a hard choice like the one that ComeBack is facing with Pentox.  The ONLY substance I know of, once again, that both suppresses autoimmunity AND increases healthy immunity is Vitamin D.  Everything else tends to be dicey.  I would NOT agree with her that increased use of amino's is CAUSING these problems.  I would attribute that to an epidemic of Vitamin D deficiency, but skin doctors typically are so biased against Vitamin D its pathetic.  In fact skin doctors are prejudiced on a whole variety of supplements in my most humble opinion.  They won't care much about your Peyronie's, in their opinion your penis is expendable, they only care about keeping your skin beautiful and cancer free.  - George

(ALC and immune function)
(Arginine and immune function)
Vitamin D article
Vitamin D article

[slowandsteady]

I just want to add for everyone that even in the Dr. Lue study, only pentox is used, no l-arginine or ALC, these supplements haven't been study and are kind of unknown

Not true. ALC has been the subject of a randomized study in which it was compared to tamoxifen (PMID 11446848).

Acetyl-L-carnitine reduced penile curvature significantly, while tamoxifen did not; both drugs significantly reduced plaque size. Tamoxifen induced significantly more side-effects than acetyl-L-carnitine. CONCLUSIONS: These results suggest that acetyl-L-carnitine is significantly more effective and safe than tamoxifen in the therapy of acute and early chronic Peyronie's disease.

s&s

[Iceman]

if ALC is so good why arn't more people talking about it - btw just downed another 1000mg.....yeh!! - bring it on...

[nemo]

Well, I guess I'll split the difference and reduce my Arginine consumption to half and only take one gram a day.  George, what about PLC - how does that figure into this, good or bad?

Nemo

[ComeBacKid]

I meant a study in which pentox was included with it at the same time!

Comebackid

[Iceman]

im gonna eat ALC + pentox like peanuts in a bowl - as much as i physically can

[slowandsteady]

I wouldn't get too carried away with ALC. Three grams is causing restlessness at night with elevated heart rate, even though I took it in the morning. Your weight might play a role. I'm not huge at 145 pounds.

s&s

[Hawk]

if ALC is so good why arn't more people talking about it -

To answer your question, I do not think it is "SO great".  There was one study on Peyronies Disease.  By any standard, the study was tiny which impacts the accuracy.  Furthermore it was an Italian study and if you follow the forum you know that there seem to be dozens of studies coming out of Italy showing favorable results on treatments that:have no follow-up, cannot be duplicated, and are never heard from again.  So the evidence is tentative and sketchy.

There is the very subjective, anecdotal stories here that it stops the pain and presumably the inflammation.  There have been no accounts of any correction of deformity.

Finally, people here ARE talking about it.  There are likely hundreds of posts dealing with the terms ALC or Acetyl L-Carnatine, or Carnatine.

[George999]

I really think that one of the takeaways here in regard to supplements is that IF it works, beware!  Just like prescription medicine, supplements that go beyond being a sugar pill, can and do have untoward and sometimes even dangerous side effects.  So use what helps and NO more.  AND what for side effects.  Someone asked at one point on this forum why doctors only give 1200mg a day of Pentox if it is so good.  The answer of course is that there is only so much the human body can take.  There is a point of toxicity and/or unintended consequences for these things.  In the case of Arginine, for instance, Nemo is doing the right thing.  Just try backing down the intake.  In many cases, side effects disappear before benefits disappear.  I think it is really great that we are discussing this because we often think we have somehow found the silver bullet and overindulge.  - George

[ocelot556]

And if you take too many sugar pills, you could develop diabetes! Ha, so NOTHING is safe if you don't use moderation.

[George999]

And if you take too many sugar pills, you could develop diabetes! Ha, so NOTHING is safe if you don't use moderation.

Life is tough ...

[Tim468]

im gonna eat ALC + pentox like peanuts in a bowl - as much as i physically can

That is not likely to help, but it probably will hurt you. Especially the pentox.

Tim

[slowandsteady]

Here's my current regimen, fwiw:

Boron: 9 mg/day
ALC: 3 g first thing on waking
Serrapeptase: 160,000 units on empty stomach in afternoon
Vitamin D: 7500 IU
Vitamin K2-MK4: substantial, but not actually measured in the supplement
Vitamin A: 5000 IU from cod liver - not synthetic
Vitamin E family: two of the Jarrow FamilE providing 500 mg of gamma tocopherol

I'm cutting back the serrapeptase to 40,000 units; I'm concerned that 4x that might be dangerous. There's a nice thread on systemic enzymes at imminst.

s&s

[Jonny13]

Hey all
About a month into pentox and L arginine.  I'm pretty sure I have better feeling in my penis and that my erections are better.  I can have and maintain erections better than before the treatment.

Is this in my head?  Placebo effect?  Has anyone else found this to be the case after such a short time?  Either way, I am feeling more confident with the treatment!  I'll be staying on the pentox for a long time to come.

[ComeBacKid]

Jonny,

Thanks for your post.  No your not crazy, I noticed the same things, bigger and better flaccid hang, and much improved erections and they stay filled up, a lot less ED!!!  Keep on taking pentox, don't quit!  This is why I have been preaching this pentox, its the only thing I've done so far that has an almost immediate effect in a positive way!  But more importantly it addresses the peyronies for the long term by blocking the immune system from attacking healthy tissue and keeping tissues inflamed and damaged, and doing further damage.  

How bad is your bend now?

Before pentox did your penis feel "harder" than usual upon erection or when flaccid?



Comebackid

[Jonny13]

It did feel harder than normal when erect.  It seems to have softened a little now, which is good.  Will we be on pentox for the rest of our lives?  Hmmm...interesting concept, but it seems problems arise when people get off of it.

I never had a bend, just a major indentation on the bottom and hourglassing.  The indentation is still there, but the hourglassing effect seems to have tapered off slightly, can't say for certain though.

[jleminster]

 

[George999]

Jason,  If you look over this forum, you will find there are a number of non-surgical treatments available for Peyronie's.  The problem is that none of them, including the traction device you are referencing, are curative at this point.  They are all able to control Peyronie's in one way or another, but none is known to reliably cure Peyronie's.  If I were you at this point, I would be doing everything possible to avoid contracting Peyronie's in the first place.  #1 would be to get my serum vitamin D levels checked and normalized.  More information on this can be found on the Vitamin D Council site and the Grass Roots Health site.  #2 would be to be prepared to start taking Pentoxifylline immediately in the event of any trauma to your penis, however slight, or any pain in your penis.  Pentoxifylline is a prescription drug that is the best drug approach to treating AND preventing Peyronie's if taken early.  - George

[LWillisjr]

jleminster posted
I am a 39 year old male who has Dupuytren disease contracture and Lederhose disease.  I am fearful now of contacting Peryonies disease as this falls into the same class of diseases.  I am not a big fan of surgery.

jleminster,
Another suggestion if you want to try to avoid Peyronies Disease is to recognize symptoms of ANY type of ED early. You are getting to the 40-50 year range in age where our erections are not quite as firm as they used to be. Many men (including myself) tend to ignore signs of ED. My thinking was as long as it was "hard enough" for vaginal entry, then I was not going to even consider ED. Many confuse ED with the inability to not achieve any kind of erection. When in fact ED covers a whole range of not being able to achieve any erection....  to achieving one but it is not as hard as when we were 17.

The problem is once your erection is "not as hard as it used to be"....  then you are more susceptible to trauma which can trigger the Peyronies scarring. This is what happened in my case. And the trauma isn't something tramatic like slamming your penis in a door or anything. It can simply be as simple as you pull out too far during intercourse, and you miss on the way back in. This can cause enough force to cause a bend in your erection if it isn't hard enough to avoid the bending. Think of a kink in a soda straw when bent too far.

Anyway.....  once you recognize ANY softness in your erection as you start to age, do not be afraid to ask your doctor to try and start something like Cialis or Viagra. You'll be glad you did.

[joecancer]

This is my first post on the forum, although I've been reading it for a couple months now.  Basically, I just wanted to share me experience, and ask a few questions.  I'm 33, and was diagnosed with Peyronies earlier this year.  One day, I noticed a curve straight up about 50 degrees where before there was none.  I don't remember any specific injury.  My doc pointed out where the scar was (near the head), and the only thing close to pain during sex that I recall was more towards the base.  (Does the scar always occur where the trauma was?  I don't recall any trauma near the head.)  

My medical history is pretty insignificant, except for some minor liver issues.  But for the past ten years I have always had what I felt was poor bloodflow and decreasing sensation "down there", so I'm not sure if that has anything to do with this.  

Anyway, I was prescribed Pentox about a month ago.  Haven't noticed results yet, but I'm hopeful.  I'm planning on going back in about three months for a follow up appointment, but now I realize there are other things than Pentox that can help.  Specifically, I'm talking about the VED treatment, and adding L-arginine and viagra to the Pentox.  

My question is this - since I've only had the disease for about three months, should I be in a rush to get on these things (since it seems the newer the disease the better chances of beating it), or is it ok to wait another three months before I see my doc?  Also, is it ok to just add l-arginine to the pentox now, or is that something that I should ask my doc about first?  I'd like to do what I can to improve, but don't want to take unnecessary risks.  Finally, I know insurance policies vary, but will insurance usually cover these things?  If so, will it usually be covered for a short time or for as long as peyronies is present?  
I want to do everything I can to beat this.  

I'll try to post my progress (hoping there is some) to help anyone else with this, and I appreciate any feedback you might have.

Thanks, Joe.

[LWillisjr]

joecancer posted the following
My question is this - since I've only had the disease for about three months, should I be in a rush to get on these things (since it seems the newer the disease the better chances of beating it), or is it ok to wait another three months before I see my doc?  Also, is it ok to just add l-arginine to the pentox now, or is that something that I should ask my doc about first?

joecancer,
Regarding your question about whether to be in a rush to start treatment. That's your decision. But I would think you would want to slow down or stop the process as soon as possible. In many cases of Peyronies Disease the initial curvature is quite sudden as you have described, and then another 10-20 degrees can set in more slowly over time. The Peyronies Disease plaque will calcify over time so you actually have a limited timeframe to try to correct the problem through medication.

Many of the guys on the forum take L-Arginine or L-Carnitine together with the Pentoxifyline. These are over the counter medications and I would think you could start this right away. Several on the forum also take vitamin E.

My question to you is why wait 3 months to start the treatment?

Les

[ComeBacKid]

JoeCancer,

You don't want to wait with peyronies disease, as the disease usually just keeps progressing, the sooner you can get to a doctor and get on some protocol the better.  

Comebackid

[jackp]

Joe

Peyronies is nothing to hesitate with. Mine started in 1995. It caused a lot of other problems, you can read at Our Histories. IMHO the longer you wait to get proper treatment and get on the VED exercise the more damage that can happen to your penis.

Go to the VED thread there is a ton of information there. Also on the Child Boards is the 26 week VED exercise. I started the VED exercise about a year and a half ago and gained back almost 3/4" on lost length. Old Man was a great help.

There are a lot of members here that are willing to help. Any questions just ask.

Jackp

[Hawk]

Joe,

Welcome to the forum.  I have to say you picked a pretty ominous name.

I will be the 4th to echo the advise of do not wait.  L-arginine is a supplement with no contraindications and there is no known or suggested reason not to take it.

I am interested in how your uro came to prescribe the Pentox.  Was that your idea or his?

[ocelot556]

Have many of you experienced progression of your Peyronies Disease while on Pentox? I'm on 2 a day, but have been feeling sore lately with the first thunderstorms of the year coming in - my dick is like a barometer these days - and am worried that some of my plaques seem bigger.

[newguy]

Have many of you experienced progression of your Peyronies Disease while on Pentox? I'm on 2 a day, but have been feeling sore lately with the first thunderstorms of the year coming in - my dick is like a barometer these days - and am worried that some of my plaques seem bigger.

It's a long term medication, and as such I'd say that you should stick with it and have some confidence that it's likely to help your condition somewhat, and at least not make it worse .  

[despise]

can you apply the full spec vitamin e to your skin? or should you do just the regular gel capsules of vitamin e?

[newguy]

can you apply the full spec vitamin e to your skin? or should you do just the regular gel capsules of vitamin e?

As a child, a scar I had was greatly reduced due to the use of vitamin E applied to the skin. Personally though, I don't think the Vit E would penetrate deep enough to be able to help peyronies. You could combine it maybe with substances which aid absorption, but that will likely allow other foreign bodies into the skin too and could cause additional problems. On top of this, it's hard to tell how much vitamin E helps peyronies. There's little risk in taking it orally though, since that's why many people do.

We have a good few tools at our disposal to aid with inflammation, though evidentally not enough, as inflammation still plagues some people. I wonder if there's anything else out that that could help, that we simply haven't thought of.  

[terryd]

was reading on heart deas.forum and found angioprim is good for cloged arteris and so many other things in clouding ed.any one ever heard of it?

[gerMike]

...However, ALC does just the opposite.  One of its effects, in fact, is to suppress TNF-Alpha and I wouldn't be surprised if it suppressed TGF-beta1 as well.
(ALC and immune function)

George, in your link I see the opposite effect for ALC. Are you sure it suppresses TNF-alpha?

=> "Thus at 50/.tg/ml of acetyl-carnitine there was strong induction of TNF-alpha but not other cytokines. It should be mentioned, however, that oral administration of acetyl-carnitine did not result in significant modifications of TNF-alpha levels."

Though they mention that it didnt influence TNF alpha when taken orally.

[George999]

George, in your link I see the opposite effect for ALC. Are you sure it suppresses TNF-alpha?

=> "Thus at 50/.tg/ml of acetyl-carnitine there was strong induction of TNF-alpha but not other cytokines. It should be mentioned, however, that oral administration of acetyl-carnitine did not result in significant modifications of TNF-alpha levels."

Though they mention that it didnt influence TNF alpha when taken orally.

Mike,  Thanks for catching that.  INDEED, I misread the abstract.  You are exactly correct.  My appologies  for the misinformation.  As you can see, I fixed my post.  - George

[newguy]

In a followup to my previous message, after some badgering it now appears that Pentox will be available on the http://www.inhousepharmacy.co.uk/ website in around a weeks time. This is good news for those in the UK and Europe. I'm unsure of whether it will be added to the US site, but hopefully it will be.  

[joecancer]

Joe,

Welcome to the forum.  I have to say you picked a pretty ominous name.

I will be the 4th to echo the advise of do not wait.  L-arginine is a supplement with no contraindications and there is no known or suggested reason not to take it.

I am interested in how your uro came to prescribe the Pentox.  Was that your idea or his?

It was his idea.  I actually went to one other doc before that, and he just gave me vitamin E.  I found out that this other doc specializes in peyronies (or belongs to some association of peyronies docs), so I went to him and he gave me the pentox.  

[despise]

my question is if full spec vitamin e is better for the skin then just regular vitamin e. i know its good for scars thats why im asking should i just apply regular vitamin e or full spec? im orally taking full spec vitamin e everyday but i also want to apply to it my skin sooo? and i asked this before but no one answered. what does fish oil do? ive heard people talk about it but what does it do? is there anything i should be taking other then vitamin e and vitamin d? should i get the gel capsule vitamin d3?  

[newguy]

despise - I would certainly go for the full spec Vitamin E. As for the fish oil, I'm not certain, but I would guess that it can have a mild anti-inflammatory effect, so it's something that people throw into their regime. Aside from those items listed, I would suggest pentox if that is available to you.  

[despise]

newguy thank you so much for your post! very appreciated! =) yes once i get my insurance im going to talk to another urologist. if he comes to the conclusion i only have peyronies even after a cycostopy then im definetly going to be demaning pentox. everyone on this forum seems to have good results for it. it saddens me i can't find out and get things better but i guess i just gotta tough it out for now. im going to look up more about fish oil. i am having a lot of swelling and well if it that will help then i need it.

[newguy]

Don't lose hope. It seems like you're being very proactive, so all you can in continue with your efforts and the rest is in the lap of the Gods. It's possible to buy pentox online, so if you have no luck with a urologist you could go that route. Maybe in the meantime you could take ibuprofen for a couple of weeks and see if that reduces inflammation at all.

[ComeBacKid]

Don't go in demanding pentox.  First print out the studies off this site and take them in with you.  Make your case and display your evidence to your doctor and point out how safe pentox is, and if your completely healthy, point that out to.  I've heard many on here say you need six months, I think more like 9 months or even a year is necessary, at least for me my first time around.  I'd request as many months prescription as you can!  

Comebackid