Stem Cells & Adult stem cell injections for Peyronie's

[rellisacct]

Chef, thanks for the follow up. I'm thinking and hoping that the plaque/scar tissue may just be deep in the shaft and he didn't hit the real problem area. I have had this for 11 years now and am seeing progress. I know that my plaques are calcified but there is still tissue growth. I know for a fact that its not in the active phase and that I've been at this point for a while, so there is still hope.  

[rd]

Chef don't give up hope I had one lump resolve a year after stem cell treatment.

[koolx]

hi chef and everyone,

u implied that if therapy doesnt sense tissue thats not damaged enough for repair, that the therapy will ignore it. just to let u know, i got an hour glass formation thats not that bad (but not good if i got it). and i got a bend to one side from penile injections. the bend is not bad, but again, its not good if i got it. the bend is about 25 degrees to the side. my erections are soft and sometimes "hard" in the morning. do u think prp/stem cells can help in my case?

hope anyone can chime in and answer this question.

[chefcasey]

rellisact, funnyfarm, and rd thanks for your words of encouragement.

koolx: Yes this was Dr. Landers thoughts on stem cell therapy.  He told me he had not had good results with men whose plaques were no longer progressing or not causing pain.  The science behind it is that if scar tissue becomes fully formed and matured with no additional inflammatory processes still going on, stem cells won't recognize it as damaged tissue and won't repair it, because your body isn't telling the stem cells that you need repairing.  Now what exactly is the criteria that your body uses to activate wound healing? I don't know, it's a complex process, but the fact that rellisact has had issues for 11 years and saw improvement tells me this process is still not well understood.  

As far as stem cells helping in your case, I couldn't say.  I too have somewhat of an hour glass shape but I now suspect the scar is more in the septum rather than the outside of the tunica, which can cause hourglassing, a good thing to keep in mind when looking into any type of injections.  I don't believe there is a good success rate with ED but something may have changed since the last time I talked to Dr. Lander.

[rd]

I checked in with Dr. Landers about maybe getting a follow up and if the procedure had changed at all, after hearing about prp and he sent me the attached file. Apparently he is using shockwave therapy in combination with stem cells was curious as to thoughts on this. I thought shockwave therapy was proven not to be effective for peyronies.

[koolx]

rd,

dr. landers also indicated to me over the phone that shock wave therapy activates stem cells/prp in the penis. i seriously have to doubt this. but just to be fair to him, its possible that i misheard  him. maybe he can reiterate to you whether this statement is correct or not.

on a side note, it appears that god hates us. i cant believe that the creator who "loves us" wouldnt heal us of these penile conditions. after all, his commandment is to "be fruitful and multiply." i thought it was interesting to state this.  

[op]

chefcasey - don't loose hope! There is other therapies over today, which can heal the penile cells (they claiming that it could), but most are with potential of side affects, for example. sound wave/shock wave therapies, silver therapies, but for me most interesting is "living cell" therapy, but as I understood stem cell therapy is on top right now.

Anyway this is nice to see some results from others! Thumb up

p.s. I guess after stem cell therapy patients need to be active, for better cells circulation. What I want to say, stem cells is not a miracle we need to put some energy too, same with minds over healing time, less stress & so on, because all this developing nerve system in our body. Anyway this is just mine philosophy based on science information, but please feel free to ignore.  

[koolx]

op, can u explain what u mean by, "silver therapies" and "living cell therapy"?

[op]

here is few examples:
Erectile Dysfunction
http://living-cell-therapy.com

Edit: it is also calling "fresh cell therapy" - "live/living cell therapy".
More details: A doctor on how live-cell therapy works | Entertainment, News, The Philippine Star | philstar.com

[yyy]

quick update:

Today I got my second ultrasound, after 2 months: my situation is improving, there's no more scar tissue in the zones in which stem cells were injected with the big needle. I would say now I have 10-15% less scar tissue than before (just my opinion).
I have to do 2-3 treatments more to get a bigger improvement but I'm pretty confident.
To be honest I do not feel great changes in erection and bend reduction at the moment, but Im sure it will improve.

[damian]

What does that "(just my opinion)" mean? Did your uro confirm that you have less scar tissue?

[damian]

Sorry mate, that was rude from me. I'm happy for you and your GOOD news are very encouraging.

Is it just me thinking that some kind of traction would benefit with the combination of stem cells?

[yyy]

He did not give me a %, He just told me I got some improvements for sure.
By comparing the two ultrasounds you can see the plaque (white coloured) with some black points inside (healthy tissue)
My opinion is that putting a needle inside the plaque gives benefits also if placebo is injected; this is why someone got results in xiaflex tests (I mean placebo) or after verapamil injections. Obviously injecting stem cell is much better than injecting nothing...
I believe traction has helped as well: my penis is clearly more elastic than before, and I gained 0.2cm after 200hours of use.

[james1947]

yyy

Encouraging to read your posts.
Do you mean 0.2cm after 200hours traction?
I got 1.2cm after using VED for a few months.

James

[funnyfarm]

Same question as James, 0.2cm (2mm) is quite small !

[yyy]

For me 0.2cm is better than nothing, and maybe its more, not easy to measure with a bend

With VED I got 0.0cm after a few months...

[funnyfarm]

No problem, and very excited to see your scar tissue improving.  I hope things continue to get better before the next stem cell treatment !

[koolx]

yyy, do u mean to say that the stem cells helped u or the prp?

[yyy]

stem cells

[koolx]

unfortunately, stem cells dont really work well in regenerating penile tissue.. weird that it works well in rats but not humans.

yyy, i got 2 questions...

1) did u ever get any prp injections?

2) have u ever experienced any hour glass around ur penis?

[yyy]

actually Im getting some regeneration...

1) No, next step will be PRP or stem cells again, but my urologist told me that stem cells can be 10times superior than PRP

2) I have a shrinkage in the zone of the plaque, seems to be reduced after the treatment but it's not easy to detect the difference naked-eye.

[Lollaro]

Sorry..
But YYY after the cure the plaque is restricted?
Aslo...i have seen that you are italian...when you done the treatment with staminal cell?

[koolx]

yyy, 3 more questions:

1 - u said u'll get stem cells next.. when will u?

2 - ur doc said that stem cells are 10x better than prp. this doesnt sound accurate according to current research and experience. did ur doc explain this in depth?

3 - where are u getting this treatment? i'd appreciate it if u provide phone number and email.  

[yyy]

Today I spoke with my urologist again, asking him some deep questions:

By comparing the two ultrasound he saw some little improvements; Next step will be some PRP injection and not Stem Cells again: this because I still have many stem cells around/in the plaque but they need to be activated. He thinks that PRP can help with that.
About his details, I should ask him before putting them on the web, and to be honest I'm not sure he speaks English

[james1947]

koolx

Just a proposal:
Invest a little bit more time when you are writing a post that also not native English speaking and sms writers can understand your posts

James  

[funnyfarm]

I agree with James,  YYY has been very generous sharing his info with us and I thank him for that. Gratzie !

[koolx]

james,

i dont understand your comment. are u asking me to write my posts clearer so non-english speakers can nunderstand me better? if this is so, i can try. i will re-post my questions to yyy. i see we have many spanish and french speakers on this forum.


yyy, here are my questions in a clearer way:

1 - did your doctor tell u why prp is 10 times stronger than stem cells?

2 - what clinic will u get prp from? provide contact info.


hopefully this can help non-englsih speakers so they can understand better. if something isnt clear, ask me to re-clarify.  

[james1947]

Koolx

Many on the forum are not native English speakers so sometimes shortenings that native English speaker are are using when sms or emailing each other are difficult to understand for us.
Like:
u = you
u'r = your or yours
etc'
Don't need to correct your posts, just for the future  

James

[Lollaro]

Koolx indeed i think that YYY said that stam cell are 10x+ better than PRP

[koolx]

james,
yes, youre right.. i will pay more attention to your suggestion. thank you.


Lollaro,
thanks.. i know yyy said stem cells are 10x better than prp. in theory thats true. but in actual practice, prp has shown to be far more effective than stem cells. stem cells have only shown minimal improvement.

also, he said that theres no need for more stem cells since the stem cells he got the last time are still around his plaque.. from what i have been informed, stem cells usually migrate out of the penis fairly rapidly after injection. i hope i'm wrong in his case. i'm a bit concerned that he may be misled. i wouldnt want that for anyone.


yyy,
please be careful if youre going to the Stamina Foundation in italy. the government almost shut it down. its under close watch now. if not, please let me know which stem cell clinic youre going to so that i can enquire about its treatment program. thank you.

[funnyfarm]

Koolx, I know you are not a fan of the Italian medical system , but YYY is doing well with his treatment, so likely he is in good hands.  And If I were him I would not push the doctor to demonstrate proof that stem cell is 10x better than PRP.  If a doctor's treatment is helping me, no further scientific evidence is needed . And it is essential guys like YYY continue to update us on their progress.  As you know, there is no 100% cure for peyronies, so we do the best we can with the few options that are available.  

You likely agree at some point each of us has to choose a solution and stick with it maintaining faith and a positive attitude to obtain the best outcome.  If it is not successful you can always adopt a new strategy later.

Also, are you aware there are stem cell clinics here in the US ?  You might be more comfortable receiving treatment closer to home. Best of luck

[koolx]

funnyfarm, i think yyy is the best person that can tell us about his health since youre not him. and if he were fine, i dont think he'd be getting a 2nd round of treatment.

can u stop misinterpreting what people say. i never asked that he insist his doc to prove that stem cells are 10x better than prp. and if a doc is making a bold claim, the smart thing to do is to enquire, not let a doc do as he pleases. being complacent and not asking questions is ignorant. if i read or hear something that doesnt make sense, i speak up. i dont stay quiet and pretend everything is ok. if thats not how you operate, thats your life. i follow a different approach.

i'd appreciate it if you can stop answering people's questions for others. let others ask what they want without representing others since youre not that person and dont know whats going on in their lives. let yyy answer our questions and see what he says. if not, then there are other threads you can participate in. we're all trying to get the best health.

[james1947]

Hi dear friends.
Everybody try to cool down and be less sensitive.
Myself has to do that also from time to time.
We are in the same boat on rough waters so better we work together.

James

[Lollaro]

 I think that with staminal cells there is much to do...probably in few years will be found a cure that will cure the Peyronies al 100%(seems impossible,but i'm convinced that will be so)... Now there is only to experiment...unforunately

[funnyfarm]

I hope you are correct Lollaro ! I don't see any other treatments as promising on the horizon.  

[yyy]

Koolx,

Thank you for worrying about me  
This is one of the doctors who offers the treatment:

Stem cell treatment for lichen sclerosus

New Surgical Approach to Lichen Sclerosus of the Vulva: The... : Plastic and Reconstructive Surgery

New surgical approach to lichen sclerosu... [Plast Reconstr Surg. 2010] - PubMed - NCBI


In this case it's a different desease but you can see He's not an improvised doctor, people come from all Europe to get the treatment.

About stem cells, I always knew that you need several months to get a complete healing and evolution, someone here such as rd can confirm it.
I had my plaque puntured in 3 points, and after the last ultrasound you can see some healthy tissue around those holes formed by the needle. My plaque is quite big so just a part of that was treated.
I repeat that now he wants to try PRP because it has a similar result of Stem cell (lower but similar) but it speed up the healing of the tissue and help to activate stem cells.
Please explain how they can migrate after being injected.....

[rd]

I can confirm that it wasn't until 2-3 months after the initial treatment one of my plaques completely disappeared. Then another just shy of a year from the date of treatment. I would love to get another treatment but just can't afford it at this time. My plaques still seem to change so I also still hold out hope they may vanish with no further treatment.

[funnyfarm]

That is very exciting RD !

Unlike a pharmaceutical agent, I think the stems cells allow the body to heal as nature intended. It just gives you a needed boost, but like many good things in life requires adequate time and patience.  

[koolx]

yyy,

i appreciate the lnks. i've talked to some docs who said that stem cells for peyronies (generally but not always) takes 3 months - 1 year for some healing to be made. in general, 3 months is the generally accepted time frame for noticeable healing.

ED is tricky also. stem cells havent been able to restore complete erectile function. whatever positive effects have been realized were minimal at best unfortunately. but more is being done to improve the technology.

believe it or not, prp has shown to be far more effective in combating ED and peyronies.

i will post a link of the problems with stem cells migrating around the body when i have more time.


rd,
i assume that you had prp done that got you good results?


also, has anyone heard from rellisacct? i havent seen him here in a while.

[james1947]

koolx

rellisacct was on line yesterday.
You may send him a PM if you have some question

James

[rellisacct]

Hey All,

I'm still around, just been really busy lately. I go back to Wake Forest next week for a follow up and further injections, so we'll see how things go. For some reason, the tissue near the first injections I had have tightened up a little again, but nowhere near where it was prior to injection. I can definitely tell that erections are harder and more pleasurable. I think that things have leveled off and I can tell that this improvement is permanent.

I'm hoping that further injections will just continue to increase tissue growth and start linking up blood vessels to improve blood flow. If this is the case, after a few more injections, I hope to start seeing some significant improvement. I'll give an update next week as things progress.

[james1947]

Rellisacct

Good to hear about your progress.
Take your time, just update us if have something new.

James

[rd]

Koolx, no prp. I only had stem cells done. They did not offer prp with the treatment I had.  

[funnyfarm]

Rd / Rellis  thank you so much for the updates guys !  This thread gets a huge number of views, so I am sure I speak for many others as well.  

[koolx]

Rellisacct,

did u get me pm's? i sent u like 3 so far..  but i never got a response from u. any reason why u failed to respond?


rd,

so.i.imagine that the stem cell treatment u got didnt give u good results.. will u consider prp next as a better alternative?

[damian]

rd
did your plaques really disappear? I mean has your uro confirmed that or are they only not palpable anymore and what did it to your deformations?
Thanks


PS.: it would be nice to write down your experience with your stem-cell treatment in one post. It is a pain to seek through these pages to find your posts and puzzle it together.

[rd]

the_uphtipack, The uro's were no help at all. They all were arrogant peace's of crap that brushed me off(Sorry for my language). The reason I know my plaques disappeared is because I could no longer find them upon examining myself and because the deformation where they were located went away. I have other plaques I have developed in other areas that I would like to have treated as well and I would if I had the money. 1 year after stem cell treatment I had three plaques disappear two on the right and one on the left upper part of the shaft. The two on the right were the ones treated and the one on the left also went away after treatment, but was not treated because I did not have that one at the time of treatment. I have 3 small plaques that have developed since down closer to the base of my penis. The others were all up near the head. My plaques also ever since getting this condition have always seems to be in a state of change. I don't know if this is part of the reason why the others resolved after treatment or not. I don't think I ever had scaring only inflammation because I can't imagine scar tissue would change size and shape and go from hard to soft to hard etc.  I have also summarized in more than one post my experience with stem cell treatment as I have found people asking the same questions of me over and over. I also posted updates as they happened. To make life easier you could always search my name and have all post from me show up. I don't post often so only a few would not be related to the treatment.

[damian]

Thank you rd.

Yeah, and no one seem to know the real difference between inflammation, scar tissue and plaque.

I hope you can afford another treatment in the near future or better it will heal from the first treatment in time.  

[egghead]

Is this treatment available anywhere in the northeast US? I've contacted a  men's sexual health center here and was told they don't do it.  

[damian]

I think it's still experimental, but costs like a real treatment.