PE traction and peyroines

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olowshinenine

Correct me if I am wrong but many people who do Penis enlargement hurt themselves doing traction correct? Which might turn into pyronines or hard flaccid or ED.

I understand why people do it for pyronines but what is the difference between PE and pyronines traction exercises.

I did traction ever so gently last night for the first time with a suction cup device similar to the PMP. And it hurt. Almost to the point I don't want to do it again. The silicon sleeve was very tight and the pull i felt was more on something inside my groin than the shaft of the penis.
Diagnosed after two uro visits march 2023. physical exam no ultrasound
Noticed upward bend october 22.
currently on 5mg cialis and using hot rice sock. trying to find right traction device
Pain started 12 2022.

Mikel7

If you use either one of the traction devices here, Restorex or PMP and follow the directions it is unlikely that you will hurt yourself. Yes some guys are over zealous and can re-injure themselves from to long traction use. You have to start out slow and be careful if you are in a lot of pain. PE is not what we do here - that is another forum. Traction is an attempt to prevent further shrinking and deformities. Also to try and regain back what was lost . It takes a lot of dedication and time .
Lump 4/2020, age 62 , Dr Levine 6-26-20, Dors Curve 11/2020, Peyronies
Vit E400mg, COQ10, Heat Therapy, Penimaster, Pentox, Cialis, Restorex
SNHL 7/2020 - Stopped all Meds because ototoxicity  Heat/traction/VED are working. CPPS Diagnosis - Stable :)

Patrick321

There is no difference between PE and Traction! Read my posts. Its a scam! Anytime you stretch the erectile tissue in flaccid/semi-erect state, it inflames giving you a false impression that the area is "filling out".
  This is giving you more Peyronies! After the inflammation settles, it will be worse and most likely be spread out through entire penis now (hard flaccid) as now the damage/ over-stretched erectile tissue has been repaired by collogen tissue (Scar/Peyronies)  Not good!
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LWillisjr

I have to step in and disagree with Patrick321. Stretching penile tissue DOES NOT always cause inflammation. Why would the top know Peyronies doctors recommend traction if it was to cause more damage? If traction was bad then you would damage yourself every time you get a firm erection.

Also there is a difference between penis enlargement traction and Peyronies traction. For penis enlargement the protocol is very aggressive. Meaning they want you to add more and more tension week after week.

For Peyronies you should not be as aggressive. The recommendation is to wear the traction to a "comfortable stretch" and just hold it there.
Developed peyronies 2007 - 70 degree dorsal curve
Traction/MEDs/Injections/Surgery 2008 16 years Peyronies free now
My History

Patrick321

Willis, its common sense. Think about it. Most men get Peyronies from bending/stretching a semi-erect penis. Many times its forceful masturbation. Guys that only have sex or masturbate with a hard erection are fine.  I think porn addiction/over- masturbating, have sex with a weak erection, forceful masturbating with a weak erection, stretching are most causes for Peyronies. Bending/buckling/over-working a weak erection is the starting point for Peyronies.
  The Western Doctors can claim that stretching cures Peyronies all they want. Im not buying it.  Over-stretching the complex penile tissue in a flaccid/semi-erect state damages the erectile tissue. The erectile tissue when damaged will always repair by healing with collagen tissue AKA Peyronies.
  The reason why it takes so long to heal is that the erectile tissue is the most complex tissue on the planet as it can stretch when ERECT 2-4 times without tearing. WHEN NATURALLY ERECTING. NOT forced stretching by hand or device.
  It is no coincidence that erectile dysfunction and Peyronies go hand in hand.  Its always when the erection is weak/exhausted that Peyronies shows up some time after.
  Each their own.  I am following the Asian guy's system and so far I am happy with the results. The scar is softening and my erectile function is improving every day.  I will never use the stretcher nor the shockwave. And I am definitely not injecting anything in my penis and having a doctor rip the living s&^t out of it AKA "Re-modeling"
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Sonic

Quote from: Patrick321 on March 30, 2023, 08:27:54 AMThere is no difference between PE and Traction! Read my posts. Its a scam! Anytime you stretch the erectile tissue in flaccid/semi-erect state, it inflames giving you a false !

https://www.peyroniesforum.net/index.php/topic,16006.0.html

Look at this post.

He pretty much straightened a very sharp Peyronies bend with a traction device.
30 years. Sudden rightwards curve detected in June 2020
Narrowing on right side and about a 20° curve to the right.
ED + instability due to narrowing.

Patrick321

He either A. Balanced the scar out with more scarring on the other side
or B. Did such light stretching that he didnt really stretch and healed naturally possibly with light VED and/or great erection quality and quantity.
I personally do Not believe that stretching the way you guys stretch (Maximum stretching) can heal Peyronies. I dont believe that Any stretching in flaccid/semi-erect state can in any way heal scar tissue and I will Never do it.
  Most get worse with stretching. It makes no sense that this one guy for whatever reason cured his Peyronies with the stretcher.
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Patrick321

And just for the record: The stretching Scam has been around forever and is as a recycled scam as the cheap ab machines sold on tv.  Men who sit on the coach with a stretcher for hours are either doing the "light stretch" which is doing nothing but wasting their time and making a fool of them or they are doing a max stretch which will cause more peyronies.
  I challenge everyone here to stop stretching for 1 month. Do nothing to the penis. I guarantee it will be worse off than before stretching.  The stretching scam must be kept going as the penis must be kept in a state of inflammation to fool the man into believing the penis is "filling out" or getting bigger.
  Manual stretching will damage the entire penis. the penis will be massive but will hang like a sausage in crotch. After it settles the entire penis will be fibrotic.
  Mechanical stretching will screw up the isolated "stretched" areas even more and usually gives hour glassing at the point of pressure that is stretching.
 The Penile Erectile tissues are Not meant to be stretched in the flaccid and/or semi-erect state! It is foolish to think so.  It is common sense.
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thegreycat

olow - PE forums have people hanging/stretching with incredible tensions as well as doing things like jelqing and clamping, all of which are aggressive and damaging. People seem to dive in head first and end up injuring themselves. Peyronies Disease traction is LOW tension, there's nothing agressive about it.

Patrick - You're claiming traction bad because stretching bad but somehow VED good?
35. No injury. Lump Feb 22.
Pain, dent, left & upward bend ~50deg. Bad EQ.
Cialis Dac 22 - ear issues.
Diagnosed Feb 23.
VED Oct 22. PMP Feb 23.
Lump reduced May 23, dent remains, angle a little better. EQ improved.

Supportive partner, depression.

Patrick321

I believe regaining full erectile function is good. Any type of stretching-any type I believe is damaging. I would not buy into the ONE claim that stretching worked.  Perhaps VED at a very low pressure could be beneficial but even that can overstretch the tissue unnaturally.  Best to work on regaining full erectile function..
  Regaining full erectile function brings fresh oxygen, nutrients, and blood to the scar for healing Without over-stretching the tissue unnaturally.  
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Mr man

Traction should be gentle. Reduce traction untill it's just a comftable pull. Say around 200g or less. When I first began traction. I instinctively pulled penis up. For 1-2 minutes. Every night before sleeping. The next morning. There was improvement. Had I not got sepsysy. Am sure I would be cured by now. Traction should be very gentle. There should not be pain. Either during or after a session.
Latest routine. Started l-lysine 3mg daily, l-proline 5mg daily. Increased vit c intake. Accompanied with almost daily vacuum therapy. Pumping to 100% Exercise caution! Made good progress. L arginine supplements and prescribed potaba are helping.

LWillisjr

Quote from: Patrick321 on March 30, 2023, 06:51:08 PMI think porn addiction/over- masturbating, have sex with a weak erection, forceful masturbating with a weak erection, stretching are most causes for Peyronies. Bending/buckling/over-working a weak erection is the starting point for Peyronies.

Buckling is the key word above. That is exactly how the specialists describe it. When you have a weak erection and there is enough force to cause buckling. An example often used is when you take a short straw and hold it between your thumb and finger and squeeze until it buckles. At the buckle point there is now a crease and this is where scarring and plaque can form.

Where I clearly disagree with you is that you include overuse and stretching in your thinking. Of course, overuse will cause a weakened erection which will make you susceptible to buckling/trauma. You are free to believe whatever you want. But stretching and/or overuse does not cause the type of trauma as with buckling. This is key to understanding what causes Peyronies and understanding why stretching with VED/traction may help.
Developed peyronies 2007 - 70 degree dorsal curve
Traction/MEDs/Injections/Surgery 2008 16 years Peyronies free now
My History

olowshinenine

Patrick what are you doing to correct your curve / hourglassing if you say traction is bad?
I just started traction because I am desperate to get a head of this but I am using very little weight. if its a gentle pull where you are not going beyond what a normal erection would be then the practice should be healthy?

 
Diagnosed after two uro visits march 2023. physical exam no ultrasound
Noticed upward bend october 22.
currently on 5mg cialis and using hot rice sock. trying to find right traction device
Pain started 12 2022.

Patrick321

Lets talk about buckling. When it buckles, one side is over-stretched, is it not?  It is all common sense. The side that was over-stretched will inflame for a period and then heal itself with collagen scarring.
  Lets talk about "light stretching". You most likely are not even stretching the was the "Expert Doctor" wants you too.  So, therefor you are doing nothing more than sitting on your coach with your member in a stretcher like a fool.  
  Which brings me to my belief that doing nothing will bring more success to men who still have erectile function and are slowly, gradually healing.
  Anyone that does the "real stretching" that I have seen on here that looks like mid-evil torture as advised by the "Great Doctor" will inflame the scarred area. That area may "fill out" temporarily giving the man a false sense of healing because now the curve will appear to be less as the "indented" area is inflamed.
  I dont list the Asian guys name here because he is called a fraud on here, meanwhile he is the only one that makes an ounce of sense. I am using his system to regain full erectile function by limiting ejaculation to 2-3 times a week. I am using his products to have strong nighttime erections, using a warm soaked facecloth 100-110 F twice a day to soften scar plus many more techniques--cupping and cardio for erectile strength
   
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LWillisjr

Quote from: Patrick321 on April 01, 2023, 12:15:58 PMLets talk about buckling. When it buckles, one side is over-stretched, is it not?  It is all common sense. The side that was over-stretched will inflame for a period and then heal itself with collagen scarring.

Which brings me to my belief that doing nothing will bring more success to men who still have erectile function and are slowly, gradually healing.

You are missing the whole point. When buckling occurs, the side that is stretched you are referring too would be the outside of the buckle.  The issue is not the side that is stretched. It is the inside of the buckle/curve where the crease/trauma happens.

Everything you are stating is "your belief". And you are entitled to it. The Asian guy's site is full of unproven theories. You can believe and follow whatever process you want to. I'm not going to keep debating this topic because you are not coming off your opinion and I am not coming off mine. I hope those methods work for you as you will be the first out of our 20k members.
Developed peyronies 2007 - 70 degree dorsal curve
Traction/MEDs/Injections/Surgery 2008 16 years Peyronies free now
My History

Sonic

@Patrick

The asian guy that you are mentioning.. Dr Lin.. How does he think his "penile balooning" technique can work for people with Erectile Dysfunction? In theory I completely agree with him that very strong erections help aid and battle the condition to become better but what if one has Erectile Dysfunction? I see nothing mentioned on his site for this except him promoting his own supplements and creams to massage the dick with.

He is anti pumping and says it causes Peyronies, sure it can if misused. He is anti traction and says it causes peyronies, probably def can damage you if misused but he fails to mention that majority cases of this disease are in association with injuries during intercourse.

In the end I think light pumping with VED or traction consistently and patiently will be better tools to use to make progress and steps forward in the Peyronies battle, rather than rubbing his "VIP Cream" on your penis and performing his "Penile Balooning Technique"

If it is helping you recover then this is good and you should continue following Dr Lin protocol but based on evidence I've seen on this forum and others in terms of pics after traction accompanied by all the medical studies on traction I think you are wrong in saying it does nothing.

There is absolutely no way top doctors in the area like Dr. Levine and Dr. Trost would be advocating traction therapy the way they do if what you say is true..
30 years. Sudden rightwards curve detected in June 2020
Narrowing on right side and about a 20° curve to the right.
ED + instability due to narrowing.

Patrick321

I've been given a warning from this site not to repeat my opinion. You cannot penile balloon with erectile function. Much of his site is about restoring erectile function. He only recommends VED after injury ONLY if you cannot achieve erection to help prevent major scarring.  I will stop posting. If anyone wants to inbox me, fine.  But I may be getting banned for posting about him which is fine.
This poster cannot be taken seriously because he repeatedly posts misinformation as fact, even after multiple corrections and warnings

Hawk

Patrick,

Since you want to discuss your warnings, Let me be clear.  We have been here for twenty years and have over 21,000 registered members and two renowned doctors on this forum.  We are very open to opinions on a wide range of mainstream and adjunct as well as alternative "treatments for Peyronies Disease.  However, we do recognize complete nonsense that wastes time and money and sometimes makes your condition worse.  We will not tolerate nonsense being promoted on this site.  If you are here to learn, then GREAT.  If you are here to push nonsense, then go to the ripoff sites you might believe in.  They will love you and your money, and it will be a happy ending for you and all of us (until your Peyronies Disease and Erectile Dysfunction get worse and your penis shrinks).

That's the bottom line.  I hope you can educate yourself here, learn, share, and feel you have support, but the decision is up to you.

 
Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

Patrick321

Actually Hawk, my erectile function is improving every day and the scar is softening.
One of your doctors uses this site to promote HIS penile stretcher. Coincidence?
21,000 members, most which have left.
  The techniques on here all lead down one road- Surgery!
  Penile implant? Not for me. Too much money and way too many complications, including amputation if it gets infected.
  It seems all the Nesbit procedures cause more problems than they are worth.
  I will stick to the long-term healing which consists of nighttime erections, ballooning and massage, ejaculation frequency, and supplements which I do believe from the results I am getting, will eventually soften/dissolve collagen scar back to erectile tissue.
  I have read too many horror stories right here on your site of the stretcher making things worse and eventually surgery/implant is the final outcome.  It seems many times the implant is botched and the client is screwed as it is all out of pocket.
  If everyone wants to line Dr. Trost's pockets and believe the way to heal scar tissue is by stretching it more, knock yourselves out!  
  The old saying "If you cant beat em', join em'  Although I will never put a stretcher on my penis, I may invest in his stretcher if there is a stock and let 21,000 men make me some cash too!
  Good luck to you all!  Patrick the Non-Stretcher
   
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richestorags

Quote from: Patrick321 on April 03, 2023, 09:48:43 AMOne of your doctors uses this site to promote HIS penile stretcher. Coincidence?
The techniques on here all lead down one road- Surgery!
 

The surgeon you are referring to is my treating physician. He was previously Head of Peyronie's Disease and Male Infertility at the Mayo Clinic, a world-renowned medical facility. He offers free 30-minute phone consultations.  I had approached him with the thought that penile incision and grafting was best way to address my condition. He responded by saying that while he is skilled at incision and grafting, anonymous surveys sent to his patients overwhelmingly showed more favorable outcomes with Xiaflex injections. I had one series of injections in mid-March and am seeing RestoreX length and counterbending milestones that seemed impossible pre-injection. He and I are now having conversations about whether a second set of injections is warranted or if the disorder has been cured.  Any suggestion that he is purely motivated by money is at best unwarranted.  
-Peyronies Disease onsite 11/2021
-Xiaflex inections by Dr. Trost 03/16/2023 & /03/17/2023 + aggressive RestoreX use
-Pre treatment curve 70 degrees, post-treatment curve estimated at 20 degrees by Dr Trost 04/11/2023
-Daily Restorex use to prevent recurrence

Sonic

Quote from: richestorags on April 07, 2023, 07:02:12 AMAny suggestion that he is purely motivated by money is at best unwarranted.  

Completely agree. It was a very cheap shot from the poster in mention. Dr Trost is one of the most genuine doctors out there who has great enthusiasm and passion for his patients to get better. Many people actually wish there were more doctors like him so to label him what patrick did was indeed a very cheap nasty shot.
30 years. Sudden rightwards curve detected in June 2020
Narrowing on right side and about a 20° curve to the right.
ED + instability due to narrowing.