VITAMINS effectiveness, interaction & questions

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Hawk

Does anyone know of a B-complex without folic acid.  It is outrageous how the saturate every food, every multi-vitamin, and every B-complex with the stuff.

I also like multi-vitamins with low Calcium, folic acid, D, and NO iron.  The No iron is pretty easy to find.

There are some concerns about all of these and I like to exclude them or regulate them in individual pill form.
Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

slowandsteady

Quote from: Hawk on August 23, 2009, 04:39:28 PM
Does anyone know of a B-complex without folic acid.

I have the same concerns too. I take methylfolate instead of folic acid. I like AOR's new formulation of their B-complex. I usually get mine from RI, but they are still stocking the old formulation with folic acid.

Thorne makes some interesting B complexes. Here is a nice one. It's a mixture of folinic acid and methylfolate.

s&s

nemo

Hawk, what's the concern with Folic Acid?  My doc has recomended I take quite a bit for an adrenal fatigue problem I have ... is there a concern insofar as Peyronie's?

Nemo
51 yrs. old, multiple auto-immune conditions. First episode of Peyronies Disease in 2002. Recurred a couple times since. Over the years I have tried Topical Verapamil, Iontophoresis, all the supps and Cialis + Pentoxifylline. Still functional, always worried.

Hawk

Because it reduces birth defects it is added to cereals, breads, multi vitamins, etc.  Problem is that it is linked to increases in several forms of cancer.  Since I (along with 75%  of the population) do not plan on getting pregnant, I would like to be able to increase my B intake without increasing my folic acid intake.
Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

George999

For whatever its worth, I have some issues with the concept of multi-vitamins in general.  One, of course, is the fact that it forces one to take nutrients they may not really need and which may, in fact, as Hawk suggests, be harmful.  The other, which is just as big a concern for me, is that multi-vitamins often contain key essential nutrients which I might sorely need, which are formulated in a way in which they are biologically useless.  I am thinking especially of multiple fat soluble vits which are notoriously ineffective in dry form.  And this creates a chain of deficiencies since other nutrients REQUIRE proper levels of those fat soluble vits in order to be properly metabolized.  So, for that reason alone, I have never been crazy about multi's.  I prefer the other approach in which I have been likened by my wife on multiple occasions to a chicken pecking at my pile of little pills.  That way, at least I can control both the quantity and quality of what I am consuming.  - George

PS - Additional problems are the fact that certain nutrients simply don't go well together and others are better taken at certain times of the day.  Some are better taken in time release formulation for both safety and effectiveness and others not.  Doing all this with a multi is a huge compromise.

Hawk

I don't disagree with any of that George but my plan has always begun with a base multi with E, C B complex, CoQ10, pycogenol, lycopene, arginine, etc added to that base at specific times through the day.

The problem with Folic acid is whether you decide to take it or leave it, you decide to do the same for the entire B-complex group since they always accompany each other.  
Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

slowandsteady

Quote from: Hawk on September 06, 2009, 04:41:46 PM
The problem with Folic acid is whether you decide to take it or leave it, you decide to do the same for the entire B-complex group since they always accompany each other.

This Canadian site has the new AOR B-complex. No folic acid; they use methylfolate instead.

s&s

George999

Quote from: slowandsteady on September 06, 2009, 05:56:09 PM
Quote from: Hawk on September 06, 2009, 04:41:46 PM
The problem with Folic acid is whether you decide to take it or leave it, you decide to do the same for the entire B-complex group since they always accompany each other.

This Canadian site has the new AOR B-complex. No folic acid; they use methylfolate instead.

s&s

BUT is methylfolate any safer than folic acid?  The both provide the same underlying nutrient.  - George

Hawk

Exactly George.  I am NOT looking for another form of folate/folic acid, I am looking to reduce the daily load of all forms of folate while still getting other B vitamins.
Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

slowandsteady

Quote from: George999 on September 06, 2009, 06:32:41 PM
BUT is methylfolate any safer than folic acid?  The both provide the same underlying nutrient.  - George

One big question is whether it's the unmetabolized folic acid that's causing all of the problems, and I don't think that this question has been conclusively answered.

Not everyone metabolizes folic acid well. Methylfolate is the form your body converts folic acid to, so at least that part of the risk is retired.

There seems to be an issue in people who have high folate but low B12:

QuoteAbout 23 percent of the volunteers had B12 concentrations that the researchers deemed low. Within that group, people who had the highest concentrations of folic acid were 9.6 times as likely to show signs of cognitive impairment as those with less folic acid. Surprisingly, anemia was also 3.1 times as common in the group with high concentrations of folic acid.

Among people with healthy B12 levels, however, folic acid appeared to protect against cognitive impairment, and it had no significant relationship to anemia, the researchers report in the January American Journal of Clinical Nutrition.


"We only found potential adverse effects in people who had low vitamin B12," Morris says. "Generally speaking, folate is good for cognition."

Pharmacologist A. David Smith of the University of Oxford in England estimates that 1.8 million U.S. seniors may be at risk of anemia and cognitive impairment because of folic acid fortification. Governments in Europe and the United Kingdom have not mandated fortification, though British officials are considering it.

"I'm recommending to the U.K. government that they don't go ahead with fortification," says Smith. He also suggests that another form of folic acid might be safer.

"Folic acid fortification: the good, the bad, and the puzzle of vitamin B-12" states:
Quote1 ) Is the balance between folate and vitamin B-12 status equally as important as the absolute concentrations of these vitamins? The application of mathematical modeling may help to answer this question (18).
2 ) By what mechanisms does a high folate status in persons with a low vitamin B-12 status cause anemia and cognitive impairment?
3 ) Is unmetabolized folic acid the culprit? Data from a small number of subjects in the United States indicate that folic acid accounts for 16% of the plasma folate in persons whose total plasma folate concentration is >50 nmol/L (19). More data on the prevalence and concentrations of folic acid in the blood are needed, the factors that influence it, and the effects it has on folate one-carbon metabolism.
4 ) Given the recent findings, would it be safer to use methylfolate instead of folic acid as a supplement?
5 ) Is the imbalance between folate and vitamin B-12 associated with any other adverse effects, particularly in vulnerable sectors of the population (eg, pregnant and lactating women and infants)? A preliminary report from India suggests that such an imbalance (low vitamin B-12 and high folate status) in pregnant mothers may have adverse effects on the health of their children (20).
6 ) Is the complex relation between folate and cancer (8, 17) possibly a reflection in part of folate's interaction with vitamin B-12?

The safest conclusion would be to make sure enough B12 is received. For myself, I'm taking l-methylfolate since my homocysteine is higher than I'd like.

s&s

slowandsteady

Hawk, you might want to look at Custom Capsule. You can leave out folic acid altogether.

s&s

Hawk

Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

slowandsteady

Over the past four days I've started adding high dose niacin to my routine, after reading in PMID 9490651 about how niacin and taurine (in a hamster model of lung fibrosis)


  • inhibit the expression of procollagen type I and type III genes
  • decreased TGF-beta1 mRNA
  • decreased TGF-beta1 protein
  • decreased lung collagen
  • inhibited TGF-beta1 mRNA expression

I have to say that it's one of the better things I've ever tried for Peyronies Disease. Inflammation is pounded way down, and a little itching is even felt, like with a healing wound. Curcumin I find to be slightly superior for suppressing inflammation, but I feel that niacin gets closer to the root cause of Peyronies Disease.

I started using inositol hexanicotinate, 2g with breakfast and 2g with supper. After several days of doing this, I tried a higher dose of nicotinic acid that I had previously used. I was surprised to find that I could take 500mg of nicotinic acid after lunch and not be particularly bothered by flushing, whereas before 200 mg would give me quite the flush. Inositol hexanicotinate works as a timed release version of nicotinic acid. My goal is to replace some of the niacin from inositol hexanicotinate with nicotinic acid.

I also take 2g taurine with breakfast and supper, and am considering increasing that too.

s&s

newguy

I started the taurine thread because although I've been here for a long time, it'd something that I'd never taken until very recenty. When you look at the research it is useful for fibrossis and inflammation in a number of organs (in some animals) and as such it seems like something worth of time. I haven't tried the Niacin and taurine combo though, so maybe it's something worth trying. I have felt this itch you talk of on occasion. It happened to me when I started taking pycnogenol with my l-arginine, but didn't last for long. I worry about the protective effective that pycnogenol has in peyronie's, so perhaps it is actually best suited to those with very recent peyronie's (to help with quick healing), or those with a stable condition to help with erections. Just a theory.

Can you let me know the niacin supplement you bought? I tend to buy from iherb as they have a good selection, though am able to get cheap taurine from holland and barret here in the UK, so that's less of a problem.

slowandsteady

Sure, it's all iherb. I'd post the links but I don't seem to be able at the moment.

Inositol hexanicotinate (Now Foods, Flush-Free Niacin, Double Strength, 500 mg, 90 Vcaps)
Nicotinic acid (Nature's Way, Niacin, Nicotinic Acid, 100 mg, 100 Capsules )
Taurine (Now Foods, Taurine Powder, 8 oz)

It's interesting that another poster reported relief with HBOT (hyperbaric oxygen therapy), which increases oxygen in the blood and tissues. It can actually oxygenate tissues farther away from capillaries. Niacin, which causes small capillaries to get larger might have a similar effect.

Skjaldborg

Quote from: slowandsteady on September 29, 2009, 11:01:59 PM

It's interesting that another poster reported relief with HBOT (hyperbaric oxygen therapy), which increases oxygen in the blood and tissues. It can actually oxygenate tissues farther away from capillaries. Niacin, which causes small capillaries to get larger might have a similar effect.

Pentox increases tissue blood oxygen as well, at least in studies I have read regarding its use in congenital heart disease and the treatment of radiation therapy complications. From what I can see, oxygen plays a big part in reducing fibrosis. The other side of the coin is that diabetes, heart disease and smoking, which reduce circulation and lower blood oxygen levels, contribute to the development of Peyronie's.

I think I might try niacin myself. This is great information.

Ralf3

well, is not Niacin just an other name for the vitamin D3 ??

slowandsteady

Quote from: Ralf3 on October 01, 2009, 10:26:45 AM
well, is not Niacin just an other name for the vitamin D3 ??
No, it's actually vitamin B3.

Ralf3

Quote from: slowandsteady on October 01, 2009, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: Ralf3 on October 01, 2009, 10:26:45 AM
well, is not Niacin just an other name for the vitamin D3 ??
No, it's actually vitamin B3.

I am sorry...I was blind. ;)

despise

very interesting  :) I am still struggling with 1 cig per day so again here is another great reason to quit. I have taken naicin a long time ago for other reasons and I am interested in buying it again for this.

Tim468

"I am sorry...I was blind."

I suggest Carotine, then.   ;)

Tim
52, Peyronies Disease for 30 years, upward curve and some new lesions.

newguy

Aspirin totally eliminated the niacin flush for me. I know it naturally decreases over time anyway, but this seems to stop it dead. Is that a good idea though? The flush for all intents and purposes appears to be a positive thing. Does its elimination mean that some of the benefits of niacin are lost?

slowandsteady

The full text of the article Homocysteine as a Risk Factor for Vascular Disease is available.

In this paper, the authors find an increase in collagen production in a dose dependent fashion when homocysteine is added to cell cultures. The lowest dose at which this occurred was 50 µmol/L, which many people have but is still quite high (my homocysteine was around 13 a couple of years back but is now around eight).

Like atherosclerosis, Peyronies Disease also has increased collagen deposition, smooth muscle cell defects, and "excessive deposition of extracellular matrix protein".

The paper also stated that "SMC proliferation is stimulated by short-term exposure to Hcy". Plasma homocysteine is usually measured after fasting, so I wonder if it peaks day to day. [Edit: it appears to be fairly steady, actually.]

The interesting part is here: "The addition of aqCbl inhibited the Hcy-induced enhancement of SMC proliferation, collagen synthesis, and total protein synthesis".

QuotePatients with genetically impaired remethylation of Hcy caused by Cbl C, D, and E mutations involving the intracellular metabolism of Cbl can have normal plasma Cbl levels but still be hyperhomocysteinemic. Such patients, when treated with hydroxocobalamin, which is converted to aqCbl at physiological pH, improve clinically.

I have some hydroxocobalamin on order from RI and will give it a try once it arrives. It would be interesting if it turned out that Peyronies Disease sufferers have a cobalamin mutation.

s&s

despise

I eat a bowl of cereal of multigrain cheerios everyday before work and I have to say I feel like crap within hours =P I wonder if it's because its pro-inflammatories or because of all the vitamins I most likely don't need.

slowandsteady

Based on this study I'm going to stop taking the niacinamide form of niacin. I'm sticking with nicotinic acid (100 mg 2x day) for the time being.

skunkworks

Just about to buy a lot of Vitamin E from iherb, just wondering what people think would be the best kind. What should I be looking for?
This is an emotionally destructive condition, we all have it, let's be nice to each other.

Review of current treatment options by Levine and Sherer]

cowboyfood

get the all natural type, not synthetic.

Currently:  L-Arginine (2g), Vit D3)

slowandsteady

I recommend an E that has a good ratio of gamma to alpha tocopherol and has the tocotrienols too, like Jarrow FamilE (my first choice) or Gamma E or NOW Gamma E complex.

skunkworks

Hmm i think i saw that Now Gamma E on iherb so that might be a go.

Thing is I have seen some great posts on what to look for, what is important in a vit E supplement on this forum, but cannot find them with search function.  
This is an emotionally destructive condition, we all have it, let's be nice to each other.

Review of current treatment options by Levine and Sherer]

Fred22

Isomer E from GNC is a good one, although I have my doubts that vitamin E actually helps.  I know Dr. Levine states that there are no reliable studies to back up its efficacy and he doesn't recommend it.    I've been on 400 to 800 IU (and at times 1200) for over a year and a half and it's definitely done nothing to relieve the pain or reverse the deformity.  However, there's no way of knowing if perhaps things would have gotten even worse without it???  I just ran out last week and I've just about decided to say off for a while.  

Fred  

skunkworks

This study is why I take it:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10098440

Striking regression of subcutaneous fibrosis induced by high doses of gamma rays using a combination of pentoxifylline and alpha-tocopherol: an experimental study.
This is an emotionally destructive condition, we all have it, let's be nice to each other.

Review of current treatment options by Levine and Sherer]

MikeSmith

Whole foods has a big bottle of 365 pills that are 400mg each. It was not too much more expensive than everything else I've been paying for.  I've heard from various places that the whole foods brand of supplements is one of the more reputable / dependable across the board.  

slowandsteady

Quote from: MikeSmith on April 25, 2010, 05:13:08 AM
Whole foods has a big bottle of 365 pills that are 400mg each. It was not too much more expensive than everything else I've been paying for.  I've heard from various places that the whole foods brand of supplements is one of the more reputable / dependable across the board.  

It's a crap shoot. How do you know how much gamma versus alpha tocopherol is in there?

BrooksBro

Quote from: Fred22 on April 24, 2010, 03:56:42 PM
Isomer E from GNC is a good one, although I have my doubts that vitamin E actually helps.  I know Dr. Levine states that there are no reliable studies to back up its efficacy and he doesn't recommend it.    I've been on 400 to 800 IU (and at times 1200) for over a year and a half and it's definitely done nothing to relieve the pain or reverse the deformity.  However, there's no way of knowing if perhaps things would have gotten even worse without it???  I just ran out last week and I've just about decided to say off for a while.  
Fred

My experience was the same, I could not tell that it did anything for me.  Like you, when the last bottle ran out, I didn't buy anymore.  I cannot tell that anything has changed since I stopped taking it either.

MikeSmith

Quote from: slowandsteady on April 26, 2010, 01:08:59 AM
Quote from: MikeSmith on April 25, 2010, 05:13:08 AM
Whole foods has a big bottle of 365 pills that are 400mg each. It was not too much more expensive than everything else I've been paying for.  I've heard from various places that the whole foods brand of supplements is one of the more reputable / dependable across the board.  

It's a crap shoot. How do you know how much gamma versus alpha tocopherol is in there?

oh it just says mixed...is that bad? Is one better than the other?

slowandsteady

Quote from: MikeSmith on April 29, 2010, 12:07:22 PMoh it just says mixed...is that bad? Is one better than the other?

The issue is often confused in that when "vitamin E" is mentioned, only the alpha tocopherol component is meant, when in fact there are 4 tocopherols and 4 tocotrienols in the vitamin E family. Additionally, there is a synthetic form of alpha tocopherol (dl-alpha tocopheryl) that is different from the natural version of alpha, d-alpha tocopheryl. Many if not most vitamin E supplements use the synthetic form.

From "{gamma}-Tocopherol, the major form of vitamin E in the US diet, deserves more attention" (American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 74, No. 6, 714-722, December 2001):
Quote{gamma}-Tocopherol is the major form of vitamin E in many plant seeds and in the US diet, but has drawn little attention compared with {alpha}-tocopherol, the predominant form of vitamin E in tissues and the primary form in supplements. However, recent studies indicate that {gamma}-tocopherol may be important to human health and that it possesses unique features that distinguish it from {alpha}-tocopherol.  {gamma}-Tocopherol appears to be a more effective trap for lipophilic electrophiles than is {alpha}-tocopherol. {gamma}-Tocopherol is well absorbed and accumulates to a significant degree in some human tissues; it is metabolized, however, largely to 2,7,8-trimethyl-2-(ß-carboxyethyl)-6-hydroxychroman ({gamma}-CEHC), which is mainly excreted in the urine. {gamma}-CEHC, but not the corresponding metabolite derived from {alpha}-tocopherol, has natriuretic activity that may be of physiologic importance. Both {gamma}-tocopherol and {gamma}-CEHC, but not {alpha}-tocopherol, inhibit cyclooxygenase activity and, thus, possess antiinflammatory properties. Some human and animal studies indicate that plasma concentrations of {gamma}-tocopherol  are inversely associated with the incidence of cardiovascular  disease and prostate cancer. These distinguishing features of  {gamma}-tocopherol and its metabolite suggest that {gamma}-tocopherol may contribute significantly to human health in ways not recognized previously. This possibility should be further evaluated, especially considering that high doses of {alpha}-tocopherol deplete plasma and tissue {gamma}-tocopherol, in contrast with supplementation with {gamma}-tocopherol,  which increases both. We review current information on the bioavailability, metabolism, chemistry, and nonantioxidant activities of {gamma}-tocopherol and epidemiologic data concerning the relation between {gamma}-tocopherol  and cardiovascular disease and cancer.

These findings I feel are important in light of the epidemiological data that large doses of vitamin E can increase all cause mortality, such as this study (PMID 15537682), which concluded "High-dosage (> or =400 IU/d) vitamin E supplements may increase all-cause mortality and should be avoided".

For those taking larger doses of vitamin E long term, it would appear that the safest thing to do is to take a vitamin E supplement providing gamma in a good ratio to alpha (at least 5:1, but I'm not sure how large this ratio needs to be). Looking at iherb, I am uncomfortable with the NOW gamma E, which has closer to a 1.1:1 ratio. Jarrow gamma E and Carlson's gamma E might be a better bet at about a 6:1 ratio.

s&s

Trev

I have read many of the post regarding vitamin supplements and wanted recommendations on a good vitamin starter program with proposed daily dosages. On my current list are:

L-ARGININE 1000 mg
L-CARNITINE 500 mg
ALOE VERA 470 mg
Vitamin E 1000 IU

Any suggestions or alternative combinations are welcome.

cowboyfood

Vitamin D3, capsules, and you might research Vitamin E on this forum and determine that 400IU of it is sufficient.
Currently:  L-Arginine (2g), Vit D3)

joe

I would add fish oil to the list.  I am also taking vitamin D since George999 talks so highly of it.   You may want to search the forum for his posts, he has a vast knowledge of oral supplements.  I have never taken aloe.  Otherwise your list is good.

-Joe

SSmithe

I had my Vitamin D levels checked and they were normal... Does George999 suggest still taking Vitamin D even though one tests within range?  
I don't want another pill to take if I don't have to...
SSmithe
32 years old.  Peyronies since 22. Stabilized peyronies plaque.  ED.  Trying to stay positive.

BrooksBro

How did you get this done?

Quote from: SSmithe on June 11, 2010, 04:22:51 AM
I had my Vitamin D levels checked


slowandsteady

For $65, you can get this kit (linked from the vitamin D council site). It comes with a finger lance and you put drops of blood on a test card and mail it back to ZRT labs.

SSmithe

Brooks Bro,
I went to an endocrinologist to get blood test done on Adrenals, Testosterone, Iron content (for hemachromatosis), etc... I had him add in B and D serum.  If you have not already, I recommend it, as it is nice to be able to cross some items off your list so you can better focus on what counts.
I was normal for all things (while being on the low end of normal for Testosterone).  
SSmithe
32 years old.  Peyronies since 22. Stabilized peyronies plaque.  ED.  Trying to stay positive.

keepbatmangritey

OK so I have a dilema I have been taking large amounts of Vitiman C 5000% for my septal peyronies which runs right above the entire length of my urethra its like a metsl cable in my penis. The problem is that I noticed it working in that I suppose the accidity was softenting and breaking the plauqe and everything was going well till I read that Vitamin c is bad for peyronies because it helps produce collagen which is what plauqe is mostly made of, however there are 3 types of collagen and I feel like its being oversimplified.
but then I read somewhere that vitamin c increases the qulity of collagen so your body uses less plauqe wheras if your collagen defficent your body will use whatever it can find resulting in exess plauqe of poor quality. So im at a cross roads because i noticed vitamin c helping but it could either make it worse or better.

George999

Well, here's my personal opinion:  1)  I have seen no convincing evidence that Vitamin C is helpful for Peyronie's.  That does not mean that it is not helpful.  It only means that I have not seen any real convincing evidence that it is.  It *might* be helpful to some people and not others.  2)  I really do NOT consider the whole argument about collagen applicable to Peyronie's.  The problem of abnormal collagen deposition in the case of Peyronie's is due to metabolic issues.  Supplements affecting collagen are not, in and of themselves, likely to make that problem better OR worse because of any effect they may have on collagen in my opinion.  I believe that the whole issue of "collagen", like the issue of "circulation" is a canard.  The real issues surrounding Peyronie's are things like inflammation and immune response.  Things that aggravate inflammation can aggravate Peyronie's and things that lower inflammation levels can alleviate Peyronie's symptoms.  Things that alter immune function can either aggravate or alleviate Peyronie's symptoms.  I have NEVER seen any evidence that addressing either collagen or circulation issues has any effect on Peyronie's at all.  Others here will stridently disagree, but this is, nevertheless my opinion.  Disclaimer:  I am not a doctor, but have been dealing with Peyronie's as a patient for around six years.

My advice:  If Vitamin C seems to be helpful to you, keep taking it and don't pay a whole lot of attention to the collagen issue.  IF you take lots of Vitamin C, make sure you are taking plenty of magnesium as well to help protect your kidneys from oxalates.  On the other hand, if you want something that really works, try Pentoxifylline.  There are a NUMBER of guys around here who will vouch for the effectiveness of Pentoxifylline.  And there is some evidence that Pentoxifylline may work even better when taken concurrently with Alpha Tocopherol.  Aside from that VED and Traction have shown good results around here over the long term for MANY guys.

freckle

I read on a post, or somewhere, that excessive use of Vit E. can lead to high blood pressure and other cardiovascular disease.  Anyone heard of this?

George999

Quote from: mlc on June 22, 2010, 10:28:17 AM
I read on a post, or somewhere, that excessive use of Vit E. can lead to high blood pressure and other cardiovascular disease.  Anyone heard of this?

Most if not all of the harmful effects of Vitamin E are due to its suppression of Vitamin K.  Simply taking Vitamin K along with Vitamin E can mitigate this problem to a large degree.  I recommend that people taking large amounts of Vitamin E also supplement with Vitamin K to avoid Vitamin K issues.  Lack of Vitamin K activity results in soft tissue calcification and thus hardening of the arteries among other things.  It also leads to bone problems.  - George

cowboyfood

Just got an email from Puritans Pride...they're starting one of their big "3 for 1" sales today.

http://www.puritan.com/

of course, I just bought some stuff last week, but now that you mention Vitamin K, I might get some of that and some more L-argnine.


CF
Currently:  L-Arginine (2g), Vit D3)

freckle

George999, you have an incredible knowledge.  Since there is a 3 for 1 sale at Puritan, what would you recommend that I should start with.  I ran out of the 400 IU of Vit E. last night, and that prompted my search on the internet for solutions that lead me here.  I take alot of vit. supplements as it is.  What specifically should I be looking for to help with Peyronies Disease?  I am taking Melaluca's Vit. D, calcium, joint help, vit c, and Melaluca's multi. (None of which was intended for Peyronies Disease.  The Vit E. was all that I have been doing for that.)  When I get home tonight I will look at the others.  I would appreciate your take on what I am doing, right or wrong.  

freckle

After some good advice from Brooksbro, I would like to find a good male sex specialist that know and can deal with Peyronies Disease.  Anyone know of one in Utah or surrounding states.  I have alot of airmiles with Southwest and Arizona, Nevada, California would not be bad trips.