Congenital Curvature or Peyronies Disease

[RedSunn]

Please tell me what is VED
Thank you

[RedSunn]

Do you have any insurance at all?  I only have state insurance for my son, but they have been spectacular at working with us once we worked with their rules, even allowing us to see two specialists out of network and out of state so far.  The big thing is to work with your family doctor to get referrals and testing done.  Sometimes the way that they respond to denials (appeals) and the way they request referrals and tests is EXTREMELY important in how an insurance company responds.  Like fully explaining the problem and what the test would determine and find out for you.  Listing the degree of your problem and how it affects you is important as well, both physically and emotionally.  Once you get any type of referral or test approved, you need to list and use them in any future request so they have that info to go on, sometimes simply knowing that they have approved things for this before can make a difference, especially if you list the reason for the further need of it.  I would DEFINATELY get the dopplar test anyway, 10% seems a large number for error to me, especially when of such a sensitive nature, I know I would do it for my son.  When asking the insurance company, I would have it stated not that the dr is 90% sure of the other diagnosis, but that there is still a 10% chance of another difficulty and the problems that not knowing for sure that would arise from it.  Most of these insurance people have never come across this problem, most of our doctors don't either, they have had to learn just to help with referrals (which I thank them so much for).  So when asking your insurance company for a test or referral, educating them on the reasons, problems, possible help or hinderances with or without the testing is extremely important, especially if you want to see a certain doctor.  There are reasons you may want to see a specialist and not in your network.  Seeing someone IN their network and telling that doctor of your want to see a specialist (especially if you have gone to other urologists who have been unable to help) could be a big key.  Clueing them in that OTHER non-specialist urologists have been unable to help (maybe give a reason or two) makes it feasably ok for THEM not to fully know what to do with you either, without making them look bad.  This is one of the things we did to get our first out of network out of state referral, seeing some urologists that they stated we could see as opposed to the one requested.
Our previous family dr was awful at requests/referrals/appeals.  Even our new one seems to not know what to put on them.   I have given our doctor's office VERBATIM things to write on the appeal or initial request.  they actually didnt know much about it at all, so my help was imperative to the request.  Try to keep it short or alert them that you will email or fax them the information to be added.  Most time faxing them info leaves less work for them.  Send it on a sheet that is solely to go to the request/appeal with only that info so they can just add it to the papers that they send.  Make sure it sounds professional using the proper termanology.  Again, keeping it short and to the point is preferable.
ALSO if your doctor's office is not so keen at doing the referral/appeal thing, there should be someone at the insurance company who can help you with that.  I did my first appeal by phone with the insurance company.  The person on the phone was a great help in alerting me to what they were looking for as far as medical records and information that would be necessary to have a positive outcome for our request.

I would definitely get the other test done, though.  10% is big enough to want to have it done!

[stealthmeister]

Hello all,

I'm new to the forums and I have a few newbie questions so please bear with me.  I have a downward curvature, but I'm not sure if it's congenital or if it's peyronies.  

I'm pretty sure that when flaccid, I do not feel any existence of plague.  So would an induced erection with plague be a tell-tale sign that it's peyronies?  What if there is no plague when fully erect?

So is the lack of plague be 100% confirmation that it's congenital?  If I would go to a uro doctor, what type of tests is at their disposal to confirm if my bend is one or the other.  

Many thanks in advance.

[LWillisjr]

Stealthmeister,

One other thing to add to Old Man's suggestions........

Congenital curves occur at birth, meaning you were born with it and will always have it. Congenital curves are also "generally" gradual, meaning banana shaped.

Peyronies Disease will cause a sudden change in curvature. Meaning your erection may be genreally straight but then at the point of plaque formation you will get a sudden curve. Go to either wikipedia or the Mayo clinic site and search for Peyronies disease. There are some pictures/diagrams that show typically Peyronies curves.

[bentwilly]

Hi I'm new here, 21 years old. About to go see a urologist in a week, Peyronie's was listed under the areas they specialize in so I have hope.

I'm going to describe this the best I can...

As long as I can remember I have had a downwards curve to my penis (as long as I can remember being when I was 12-13, but may not have had it before then?) seems to be in the 20-30 degree range as far as angle, and it feels as if the middle-lower left side isn't expanding properly. I can feel what seems to be a small bump, and there are also cord/ring-like bands that aren't on the right bottom side or on the top of my penis. There is also a blue area with a weird looking scar tissue line across it. It seems as if the cord lines pull it down when it starts to get erect.

When fully erect against the curve it is impossible, it gets so rock hard, doesn't remain soft like the upper side. I am wondering if this is Peyronie's, or congenital? I wore tighty-whitey underwear growing up and always had my erections bend down that way, the curve is right where it would be pressed against my testicles. Would having erections in those type underwear cut off the blood circulation and therefore lead to a damaged penis? It seems like it stunted the growth or something. I never recall having injured it, although I might have at some point.  

[LWillisjr]

Many of us grew up in the tighty whitey generation. If that were the case we would all have bent or damaged penises. I don't think underwear has anything to do with it.

Based on what you have described, none of us here can determine if you have Peyronies Disease or not. It could be Peyronies Disease and/or it could be congenital.

You are taking the right steps in going to see a urologist and getting a medical opinion. If (and I repeat if..) you are diagnosed with Peyronies Disease then there is a lot of information on this web site to help with different therapies.

[bentwilly]

Hi Les, thanks for the response. I am actually now pretty sure it is Peyronie's as it seems it was not always like that when I was very young...It definitely got damaged at some point, as much as I rack my brain I can't remember though. It's almost like gonzo's nose! As far as function, it works fine, no problems there. Still get good erections but something is in there causing the curve.

I have been reading and enjoy this forum very much so far, it's quite good in making you feel less alone about your condition.  There is so much information and people to talk and other stories, it's very comprehensive moreso than many Peyronie's sites. I am happy I have an appointment with a urologist, I will definitely post back with what he says. I have hope that the modern medical world can make ol' one eye a bit more straight.

[bbs]

Does anyone else suffering this condition have a curve opposite of the side of the scar tissue? I recently went through inflammation on the right side of my penis and Ive noticed a slight curve downward to the left.  Would it have to be congenital if the curve is opposite of the scar tissue?  It feels like almost the opposite of the curve effects of most people (the damaged side stretches more than the undamaged side) but i know Ive done damage because of the pain, bruising, and inflammation.  Some one please help

[newguy]

Does anyone else suffering this condition have a curve opposite of the side of the scar tissue? I recently went through inflammation on the right side of my penis and Ive noticed a slight curve downward to the left.  Would it have to be congenital if the curve is opposite of the scar tissue?  It feels like almost the opposite of the curve effects of most people (the damaged side stretches more than the undamaged side) but i know Ive done damage because of the pain, bruising, and inflammation.  Some one please help

If we take as the benchmark, whatever your penis looked like when is had stopped growing (as a young adult), any changes beyond that would not be classes as congenital. If you have scar tissue on one side that is indicative of peyronie's. Of course it's not impossible to have peyronie's AND a congenital condition, but if your penis was straight previously and now isn't, then that is indicative of peyronie's. Scar tissue isn't always palpable so the left side could have scarring too.  It may not be undamaged as such. I would recommend trying to get on pentox (trental) and using a vacuum device to try to combat this process. Go see a urologist first to get further opinion on this situation.

[LWillisjr]

Of course it's not impossible to have peyronie's AND a congenital condition

Newguy,
I think it WOULD be possible to born with a congenital curve, and then later in life develop a second curve due to Peyronies. So I don't think they are mutually exclusive.

[Tim468]

BBS,

Although it is difficult to understand how scar could stretch out MORE than normal tissue, are you really sure that there is scarring? Could there be damage to the tunica that allows it to flare out (like some sort of unhealed rent in the tunica)? If you injury is recent, things may be in evolution. If this is the case, I hope that you are hurrying to a urologist to see what the deal is. It is very unusual to hinge away from the damage - and it may require a very different approach to healing or repairing it. The more detailed information you get, and the sooner you get it, the better.

Tim

[bbs]

thanks for the responses everyone, I'm not really sure whats going on but all i know is i for sure have damaged the right side and i have a slight curve to the left.  As of now i dont have much scarring but i know that that will be coming in my future. Has anyone went through the acute stage and noticed it went from bruising to scarring?  Could this bruising possibly go away without any scarring?.. Ive had it for seven months now.

[rwil]

A few months ago I consulted a Dr regarding what I thought was Peyronies Disease.  When discussing the issue with the my Dr, he asked if trauma had ocurred (I am 28 so natural Peyronies Disease was not the case).  I informed him I remembered an instance in which my penis was bent and I heard a pop sound.  He asked if I experienced swelling, bruising, and/or pain.  Of which I indicated I did not.  I also informed him I thought my penis had been bent as long as I could remember.

The Dr indicated that it may be the result of something called Chordi, and probably wasn't due to trauma due to the lack of bruising, swelling, or pain.  He said he'd only really know once the skin was pulled back during surgery.

I opted to go ahead with the surgical procedure.  The Dr cut some fiber, or indicated he removed some of the chordi, and did a small Nesbit procedure for additional straightening.  About 3-4 weeks after the surgery, I was able to maintain an errection, and I noticed it was straighter.  It wasn't perfect by any means, but better.

It has now been roughly 10 weeks, and the 'bend' has re-established it self.  I have before and after photos, and the change is fairly insignificant.  I can't help but question was it worth it...the scar, the recovery, the expense, the loss of sensitivity etc for such little difference.

Why would it be relatively straight fairly soon after the surgery, and then go back to it's original form?  Is it possible the sutures in the Nesbit procedure were not tight enough?  Is this common?  Is it possible the Dr misdiagnosed the issue and potentially performed an incorrect procedure?

The major lasting effect has been loss of sensitivity.  If I were to have a 2nd Dr diagnose and perform the correct procedure, would I lose additional sensitivity?  Should I accept this is what nature intended, or are additional/correct options available?

[keepitstraight]

Hi,

Chordee or fibrous tissue surrounding some parts of erectile bodies (mainly between the corpora cavernosa and corpus spongosium but possible surrounding this last one) can be sometimes common in congenital curvature. This fibrous/inelastic/dysgenetic tissue at some degree arrests the normal stretching of the penis thats why doctors call it abnormal development of the ventral part of the penis. But the severity or the extension of this fibrous tissue can vary much. It can be associated with hypospadias but can also be present in what is called the real congenital penile curvature. There are also the chordee withouth hypospadias and some other variants. Concidering you have the more mild case that is congenital penile curvature due to diferences in tunica albuginea elasticity or even some arrest caused by the presence of that tissue ventrally, some doctors always look for this tissue to check if it is really causing the bending or there are other things to check. I suppose the Dr. may have followed the right path releasing or removing that persistant chordee, in fact some doctors concider that one of the first steps is checking for this and also mobilizing the urethra (care is needed when doing this and some doctors use optic zooming to be able to manipulate this part avoiding injury to the urethra or any important vascular connection). Unfortunatly mobilizing it or removing the chordee is in most cases not suficient to correct the curvature, so the nesbitt or other modified technique is applied in the dorsal aspect of the penis (concidering that you have a ventral curvature). One question: your doctor told you if he did the plication technique, because sometimes this one is wrongly associated with the nesbitt one. The technique described by nesbitt is excising small ellipses of tunica albuginea and suturing (most preferably with absorbable sutures). Sorry for the text. Well recurrence as you noticed in your case should not be expected unless he did a plication (that actually uses non aborbable sutures meaning permanent sutures relying on the strenght of the sutures to maintain the penis straight). In this case sutures broking means recurrence but it can also happen in the traditional nesbitt technique. Dont forget that young patients tend to have strong erections. Its dificult to know if it was the doctor fault, one thing is for sure recurrence is a sign that the problem still isn't solved. Lost of sensitivity is rather normal, at least in the gland area (due to the circunsicion and manipulation of the neurovascular bundle dorsally), but if extended to other parts might be not so normal. I did circunsicion already and it is true that we loose a bit of sensitivity but nothing major. I would advise you to talk to your doctor exposing the problem. And also im pretty sure and convinced that a second procedure will solve your problem. But if you go forward with that i would recommend searching very carefully for another doctor. I dont know if your doctor as much experience but if not really search for the best. I dont know where you live but i think that today there is a list of good doctors specialized in this field.

Best Regards and my best wishes,

Alberto

[newguy]

rwil - From reading your two posts, there still seems to be a lack of clarity over whether this is peyronie's or not. I'm interested to know when the "popping incidemt" occured? Was it years ago? My thinking is that, if your condition is congenital, the surgery appears to have failed in some way. Another possibility is that you did have peyronie's and the surgery was carried out too soon, meaning that the condition hadn't yet settled down. Your description of the condition being almost exactly the same as before the operation, makes me think that it might be the first option. Either way, I recommend getting another opinion on this, or going back to your original doctor with these very legitimate concerns. Once you know more, you'll be able to think more about other possible treatments.

[raz]

i don't know if i have peyronie's or nature curvature. i know that the curvature started during puberty. When i'm flaccid i still have the same amount of curvature as i am erect. Also, the opposite side of the curve it looks like it has more tissue. Could it be possible than one side got bigger during puberty because i know that's when penis growth starts. i know i didn't have an injury either.

[LWillisjr]

You have two corpora chambers in your penis, one left side one right side. And yes it is possible during puberty that one side develops more than the other. It could have been this way before puberty as well, but maybe didn't show up as much then.

Congenital curves can also be corrected, but it always comes down to how much of a curve od you have and if this is causing any problems.

Les

[SombreSoul]

Greetings all,

It's been about 2 years since I've come on here, and hadn't written much back then. In any case, I would like to tell of my situation.

I believe that I am somewhere between congenital and Peyronies. I wasn't born with my bend, nor do I have the classic plaque lump of Peyronies. I used to have a perfect penis. I remember at around the age of 8, my erections stood dead straight and faced upwards in full salute. A finer penis, you had never seen!!  

When I was about 12, I noticed that with each erection my penis was starting to bend downwards. I must say that at that age, and throughout my teen years, I didn't really care, for I wasn't really thinking about sex or my future. There was no pain during erections or masturbation, so I ignored the problem.

I STRONGLY believe that my bend was caused by sleeping on my stomach. Every morning of my life I have woken to an erection that has/is being forced downwards by me laying on it. My doctor said that this couldn't be possible, and that I have a banana bend that can occur at puberty, but I believe that forcing an erection down, especially at a young age, can cause significant trauma to the penile muscles. Of course I never intentionally laid this way, forcing the penis down. I would always be asleep and wake to find myself forcing the penis down by laying on it with all my body weight.

Over the years, my bend got a bit worse, and would also lean to the left significantly due to me masturbating in that direction. Over time I managed to bring the penis closer to pointing north by masturbating in that direction, but the bend remained, of course. My bend is just like if you hold a banana to your groin and have the bend facing downwards.

When erect, my penis is hard on the top and sides, but the undeside is soft. I have a thickish lump at the base, on the left, but this feels more like a thick vein, and doesn't bother me. There have been times when I haven't been able to get hard erections at all, or I'd get erections that stay up for a few seconds and then go down. But I am happy that when I am turned on enough, I can still get rock hard.

Anyway, during my 20's this really started to have a negative affect on me, mentally. I have no self esteem, a low opinion of myself, no confidence, I suffer from depression etc etc. I cannot talk to women, for they are a reminder of my problem. I feel inferior around other guys that talk about sex/have kids etc because they have experienced what I haven't. All my problems stem from one thing - my bent dick. As a result, I am a virgin at 36. So many negative thoughts have manifested in my brain over the years due to this problem......could I even perform with a bent dick, could I ever trust a woman not to laugh at my bent dick, would it turn off a woman (it sure turns me off!!)etc etc. I must admit that what this has done to me mentally is probably far worse than what it's done physically. I could probably enter a female easily, but I have got it in my head that I couldn't physically do it because I am not familiar with how accommodating the vagina is inside, or how tight it is (aside from my bend I also have a very tight foreskin that wont pull back, and I fear it tearing during sex - I'm dealing with this issue!). The bend has also made my length shorter than what it was when the erections were perfect.

I spoke to a urologist about 2 years ago, and he said that as long as I am not in pain and can urinate okay, then I have to live with the bend, as he wouldn't want to mess with a dick with a natural bend. Fair enough, I can live with that. I have never wanted surgery at all. If anything, all I have wanted is to talk to other guys that have had a bent dick since they were young, and see how they dealt with it, and how well they do during sex. I can only imagine, myself.

[LWillisjr]

SombreSoul,

Are you able to measure your degree of curvature? This can be a bit tricky to do and understand. I can tell you that most guys with a 40 degree curve or less, are quite able to have successful penetrative sex. I think you might find that men having a curve or some sort might be more common that you think.

[chiguy]

Most men have a harder penis on top and one the sides than on the bottom. I am not sure why. I think the most nerve bundles are on the bottom, while the stuff that the penis needs to function (Veins and all that) are closer to the top. I could be wrong.  

[LWillisjr]

The primary nerve bundle runs along the top of the penis and has nothing to do with hardness. By the soft part on the underside I'm assuming you are referring to the spongy tube the runs the entire length of the penis on the underside and encases the tube through which you urinate and through which semen will pass during ejaculation. Which is why you don't want this area to become hard as you want your ejaculate to be able to pass through.

[SombreSoul]

SombreSoul,

Are you able to measure your degree of curvature? This can be a bit tricky to do and understand. I can tell you that most guys with a 40 degree curve or less, are quite able to have successful penetrative sex. I think you might find that men having a curve or some sort might be more common that you think.

I think my curve is about 40 degrees.

[Atlas]

Hi,

I am new here... so please be nice if im breaking any rules...

I have been here as a guest a few times now but can never quite find the answer... Do I have peyronies or congenital curvature. What are the pros and cons of each... which one is easier to treat...

it does not bend left or right - just a smooth downward curve - no lumps on the underside.
It was there for a long time.. i think because in highscool i would get erections and try to hide them. ha hah... crazy i know.

[curvedd1ck]

1. Congenital curves are from a birth deformity
check (i think)
2. Congenital curves are generally a result of a difference in size or shape of the Corpora Cavernosa
check (one side longer, thicker)
3. Congenital curves can be in any direction (left, right, up, or down)
check (left curve)
4. Curves can be as much as 90 degrees !!
30-35 left curve
5. While not painful, congenital curves can cause discomfort during sex with your partner
check (no pain, still haven't had intercourse)

my only thing is, I know i've had it since at least 16 (when i noticed curve), noticed pissing left way before.. my thing is that i may have really small indents on either side? is that possibly with out peyronie's? also my right side (curves opposite way) seems to have a thick band under the skin. shouldn't that mean it should curve to the right?

looks similar to the valley intent pictures though

https://www.peyroniesforum.net/index.php/topic,5141.msg58588.html#msg58588

[james1947]

Atlas

From what you are writing you have congenital curve.
But we are not doctors and can't diagnose you from a post.
Please reach out to a specialist.
The difference is that congenital curve can be treated by surgery only
Peyronies can be treated, sometimes successfully by other treatments also.

James

[Tim_B]

james is right, sounds like congenital. but you should see a doc