ED, testosterone, veinous leakage

[BillyBob2]

I ran across this article while doing some research.  It may already be on this forum somewhere but I thought I'd throw it out there.  It certainly helped me understand how things work.  ED does not seem to be part of my problem but the knowledge and process is closely associated with Peyronies Disease.  There are little seeds of information here that may help me understand and possibly find a solution for my Peyronies Disease.  For me, this journey to find a cure for myself is a myriad of avenues of thought and brain storming.

Since links on the internet may be here today and gone tomorrow I'm pasting the article as well as providing the link for reference.
Venous Leakage


Venous Leakage

"Venous leakage."  Sounds nasty, doesn't it?  Kind of like a hemorrhage or something, eh?  Well, most guys would probably rather have a little hemorrhaging than venous leakage, because it leads to weak and/or rapidly disappearing erections.

Venous leakage describes the condition where the blood escapes from the penis and thus a good erection cannot be achieved.  An erection begins when penile smooth muscle relaxes enabling blood to infill the corpus Cavernosum, two cylindrical "caverns" of spongy tissue running within the penis. Stage two of the erection process occurs with this infilling of the corpus cavernosum.  The inflow of blood expands the spongy tissue, which begins to pinch off the emissary veins of the penis, decreasing outflow and - voila! - the erection begins to build.

NOTE:  Venous leakage should not be confused with venous insufficiency, which is a condition in which the valves in the lower legs go out due to varicose veins, deep vein thrombosis, etc.  There is some evidence that grape seed extract can help with this condition. [4]


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Venous leakage occurs when this second stage fails and bloods leaks out as fast as it infills. The "pinching off" of the outflow veins never occurs adequately and, basically, you're sailing in a leaking boat. Again, though, it's not really that the veins are leaking but rather that the veins are not receiving proper compression.

The causes for venous leakage can be summarized to several basic underlying conditions: 1) smooth muscle insufficiency and 2) structural changes of the corpus cavernosum.  Now what condition can lead to both of these erection killers?  Low testosterone, a.k.a. hypogonadism.

That's correct - low testosterone is a freight train ride to venous leakage and we're going to look at why below.  Here's the good news:  it doesn't have to be a one-way train ride - you can get off the train.

1) Smooth Muscle Dysfunction. Researchers now know that testosterone both maintains smooth muscle and the nerves the fire them in the corpus cavernosum. [1][5] For example, researchers have noted that in castrated animals, the nerve fibers and myelin sheaths around them actually shrink and "wither". And they have also noted that smooth muscle content in the corpus cavernosum decreased as well. [2] Yes, testosterone affects everything in a male!

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2) Corpus Cavernosum Integrity. The research points to the fact that low testosterone can actually affect the connective tissue within the corpus cavernosum.  While you are losing smooth muscle, you are also likely gaining more connective tissue, i.e. collagen. [1][2][5] The ECM (extracellelular matrix) changes for the worse, another structure implicated in erectile dysfunction. [6]  This is a sort of "hardening" similar to what causes problems throughout your body. You need for the corpus cavernosum to be flexible and expandable in order to properly compress the outflow.

The bottom line is that researchers have found that in a low testosterone environment, the inside of the penis literally atrophies and is replaced with inelastic, fibrous tissue.

For some of you that have discovered that you lived in a hypogonadal state for years without knowing it, this may be a scary prospect.  "Did it do permanent damage?" is the natural question to ask yourself.

The answer is probably 'yes' to some degree.  However, the good news is that studies show that if testosterone is restored, normal erectile function usually goes with it.  This means that the damage could not have been too severe from a long term low testosterone environment and indicates that a significant reversal is possible.

By the way, some of you who may not respond well to PDE5 Inhibitors, such as Viagra or Cialis, may find that restoring your testosterone restores your erections for the above reasons. One study looked at hypogonadal males who did not respond to Viagra and found a significant restoration of erectile function after HRT (Testosterone Therarpy). [3] Very similar results were found in a study of Cialis non-responders as well. [5] In other words, sometimes the problem is nitric oxide and sometimes it is low testosterone (or both).

So the bottom line is that many of you need to either Increase Your Testosterone Naturally or discuss with your doctor Hormone Replacement Therapy if you want your erections back.  And, yes, Sex is Good For You.


REFERENCES:

1) J Sex Med, 2005, 2:759–770, "The Physiological Role of Androgens in Penile Erection: Regulation of Corpus Cavernosum Structure and Function"

2) Endocrinology, Apr 1 1999, 140(4)1861-1868, "Effects of Castration and Androgen Replacement on Erectile Function in a Rabbit Model"

3) J Urol, 2004 Aug, 172(2):658-63, "Randomized study of testosterone gel as adjunctive therapy to sildena?l in hypogonadal men with erectile dysfunction who do not respond to sildena?l alone"

4) Grape seed

5) Andrologia, 2006, 38:61–68, "Testosterone and erectile function in hypogonadal men unresponsive to tadala?l: results from an open-label uncontrolled study"

6) Braz. J. Morphol. Sci., 2008, 25(1-4):35-10, "Stereological study of extracellular matrix of penile body in felis domestica: experimental model applied to erectile dysfunction"
   
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[MattFoley]

That's a great article.

I have seriously boosted my testosterone and I feel a great deal better and coupled with the Pentox, my Peyronie's has improved. I used to be a solid 90% but now it's closer to 45%.

The "good" news in my Peyronie's is that I have not lost length or girth or have gotten an "hourglass" shape. The bad news is that I have venous leakage that keeps me from achieving a solid erection. I tried 250 mcg. of Muse tonight but that didn't do anything beyond what 100 mg of Viagra can do, except without the horrific sinus congestion.

Next up? Caverject. I'm not happy to have to resort to this but I've got to see if it will do the trick. I'll see if I can get my urologist to cooperate on this.  

[BillyBob2]

I agree Matt... very informative and very good train of thought/understanding.  My thinking is that my "lump" interferes with those tiny veins  somehow either causing them to prevent the flow of blood filling the affected areas or in some way preventing the veins (valves) from being pinched close to enlarge or stiffen that portion of my penis.  For all I know it may be inflammation blocking whatever enzyme or chemical that triggers those valves to open or close.  If not chemical in nature then it would be mechanical blockage caused by the "lump".

[MattFoley]

Has your doctor talked to you about doing a color duplex ultrasound? I'm still waiting to get a referral to a doctor that can do it so they can tell me exactly what the hell is going on in my penis. I really want to know how bad my venous leakage is compared to what is normal.

[BillyBob2]

Surely you jest! ... He had never even heard of using Pentox for Peyronies Disease and he's a big time urologist at one of the world renowned urology hospitals in the US.   I think all the know about is things which turn the most money...  Apparently Peyronies Disease is not one of them since they don't know for sure what causes it or how to cure it.

[james1947]

all the know about is things which turn the most money...

Unfortunately many of them out there

James

[LWillisjr]

BillyBob2,

Are you waiting on a referral due to insurance reasons? Or think you need one to see a specialist? You might find that you don't actually need a referral. When I went to Dr. Levine I called his office and made an appointment directly, no referral needed. And he was a listed doctor in my insurance preferred list so no issues.

Just food for thought.

[BillyBob2]

lwillisjr.  I did go to a specialist Friday.  Before I went I checked it all out with my insurance co.  All is covered but I've still got a $2500 deductible and have to pay 20% plus all the drugs.   If I can keep things in check I may not even go back to a doctor since most of the drugs are available via mail order.  Rather than being out big bucks for a pecker sucker (VED) I can build my own for about $8-$10 since I already have a vacuum pump I use for bleeding brakes on vehicles.  My thinking is that this is pure logic, not Rocket science and I can't see paying big bucks for someone who doesn't know a bit more (not even as much) as what I've already learned about the disease.  If I get to the point that I feel I can't handle it on my own or feel the need for surgery then I definitely would find me a doctor to educate.  For me, it's not just about the money... it's about my body and my health.  If I were the average Joe who had no medical or science background I'd be freaking out right now....