saw my doc

[ldhw]

Well gang I finally made it in to see my Doc today. He is a family friend ive seen for years. He is a endocrinologist (a brilliant one at that) not a urologist but he has seen plenty of peronies over the years. He confirmed my self diagnosis and approved the treatment plan and dosages I am following. He still thinks it would be worth taking some vitamin e so I said I would add some to my regemin. He had not heard of using a ved for peronies therapy and was glad to have the info. Many of his patients are older and diabetic so he has recomends the use of a ved for its primary function. As a side he told me my plaques were much smaller than he usually sees, that cant be a bad thing.

[james1947]

ldhw

First good you have been to a doctor.
As he is not an uro, how he has diagnosed you?
What is the treatment that you are doing?
Any case, as your doctor said is good that your plaques are small, make your treatment to keep them at this size or to shrink.

James

[ldhw]

Well we have a good relationship. I researched diagnosed and established a treatment plan I wish to follow. He confirmed MY diagnosis and the safety and partialy the efficacy of my treatment plan. He had not heard of using vacuum therapy or pentox for peronies but saw how it could be of value. I take quite a few supplements already but here are those I take as part of my treatment. Ubiquinol 3x daily, Horny goat weed maca 3x dailly, l-arginine twice daily fish oil twice daily, full spectrum E (havent recieved and havent decided how much to take yet) , 3000mg daily (1500 twice) of ALCAR and as of this morning I take trental. I am planning on taking the trental once in the morning for a week and then adding another in  with lunch. I dont know if I will take the third dose or not, depends on side effects.
 Beyond the oral treatments I am doing vacuum therapy twice a day for 10 minute (single cyl. protocal). I have  gone from pain all the time to no pain while flacid and only very mild pain while erect, I even managed sex with the wife the other night. I have only been treating for a couple weeks now and besides the decrease in pain I have also reduced the penile curvature substancialy. If I hadnt found this place I would hate to think of where I would be right now, I am very encouraged that I can at least control the progression of this terrible affliction.

[George999]

ldhw,  You are so blessed to have an open minded and innovative doctor who is not afraid to sit down and look at research evidence with his patients.  That said, I think you are on the right path here and that you will see excellent results as you stay the course and knock down this nasty disease.  I am so happy for you.  So many patients suffer from inflexable and uncompassionate docs who insist on doing everything the old fashioned way, which in the case of Peyronie's is usually to take some vitamin E and hope it goes away.  - George

[james1947]

I would like just to add my opinion regarding Pentox.
Good approach to begin with one in the morning.
When you are going to two daily, try one in the breakfast, one in the dinner around 06 PM. I think is better to give some 10, 12 hours between them if you are taking just two.

James

[ldhw]

Thanks both of you for the kind words and input. Do you think taking the second dose of pentox so late will adversely effect my sleep?

[George999]

I think you are probably pretty safe IF you take it with your dinner (ie food).  - George

[ldhw]

Cool, thats what Ill do then. Do you happen to know what is the most common dose recomended for vitamin E?

[George999]

Vitamin E used to be prescribed at 800IU per day as I recall.  Be sure to take some K1 and K2 also it to control bleeding and cardiovascular disease risks.  - George

[ldhw]

Vitamin E used to be prescribed at 800IU per day as I recall.  Be sure to take some K1 and K2 also it to control bleeding and cardiovascular disease risks.  - George

Risks from taking the vitamin E?

[George999]

Vitamin E in any large amount disrupts a few other nutrients which can cause long term problems if not addressed.  That is why you hear reports of Vitamin E increasing cardio vascular risks etc. and why there are warnings regarding Vitamin E's blood thinning effects.  There are even concerns about Vitamin E and Prostate Cancer.

Rule #1 -  Always use a balanced natural form of Vitamin E.  Alpha Tocopherol competes with Gamma Tocopherol, and lowering Gamma Tocopherol with Alpha Tocopherol supplementation can increase certain types of oxidative stress which can increase cancer risks and cardio vascular risks.

Rule #2 -  Always use Vitamin K1 with Vitamin E.  Vitamin E competes with Vitamin K1.  Lowered Vitamin K1 levels expose one to the risk of bleeding/hemorrhaging.

Rule #3 -  Always use Vitamin K2 with Vitamin E.  Vitamin E competes with Vitamin K2.  Lowered Vitamin K2 levels expose one to the risk of calcified soft tissues which can cause cardio vascular problems among others.

- George

[ldhw]

Wow! That info makes me super excited to take vitamin E. Almost sounds like more trouble than its worth.

[George999]

Most effective treatments have unwanted side effects.  That applies to Vitamins as well as to drugs.  Fortunately, in the case of Vitamin E, there is a way to pretty much eliminate those side effects.  - George

[ashtown]

Specifically regarding vitamin E I can't recall seeing much in the way of scientific evidence to conclude it is actually likely to do any good unlike Pentox, CoQ10 and ALC, so for that reason I'm sticking to no more than 500IU of vitamin E per day and balancing with vitamin K.  

[ldhw]

Specifically regarding vitamin E I can't recall seeing much in the way of scientific evidence to conclude it is actually likely to do any good unlike Pentox, CoQ10 and ALC, so for that reason I'm sticking to no more than 500IU of vitamin E per day and balancing with vitamin K.

I may take that approach as well. I was thinking of adding it to my night supplement list. My wife suggested  a topical application of E after each ved treatment, what do you think of that idea? Would I still need the K vites if just applying topically?

[ashtown]

George is far more expert than I am on these things. All I know is that I once checked the back of the bottle for the vitamin E tablets and a single tablet of 250IU already represented more than 1500% of RDA so all this talk of taking huge daily quantities struck me as being rather fairly irrational and possibly counterproductive, especially when we are already getting vitamin E from other sources. On the face of it I like the sound of a topical treatment better. I see no harm in taking vitamin K anyway, since we often don't get much in our normal diets unless we eat lots of green vegetables. I just take a small one a day tablet of vitamin K with the RDA.

[George999]

I took Vitamin E for some time and considered it to be mildly helpful.  I also took it at levels approaching 3,000IU for several months with absolutely no additional benefit.  At this point, with CoQ10 and Pentox available, I would skip the Vitamin E.  500IU shouldn't be a problem as far as Vitamin K if you are getting a reasonable amount of green leaf veggies and occasional fish.  Even ALC is far more effective than Vitamin E.  Those are my thoughts.  - George

[ldhw]

Thanks guys. I started the topical thing after using the ved this morning. I thought it would be a light oil, it was more like slathering axle grease on my dick. Its hard to wash off your fingers even with soap and hot water. I think in light of what you have told me Ill just stay this coarse for a while. It doesnt seem to me that the benefit to risk factor for E is such that I want to take it internaly. Especially in light of the fact that I am already doing 4 of the top recomended treatments.

[ashtown]

I don't see any harm in you taking a "one a day" vitamin E and balancing with some vitamin K either in tablet form or natural diet. The main thing though is to continue the other treatments you have started and bear in mind that patience is a virtue with Peyronies because miracle fast turnarounds are pretty rare I imagine.

One of the problems I find is that there is a list of potential treatments as long as my arm but how many will really work and can I afford to bankrupt myself trying them all out? For that reason I think it makes most sense to stick as far as possible with treatments that have at least some kind of medical support in relation to Peyronies.    

[ldhw]

I don't see any harm in you taking a "one a day" vitamin E and balancing with some vitamin K either in tablet form or natural diet. The main thing though is to continue the other treatments you have started and bear in mind that patience is a virtue with Peyronies because miracle fast turnarounds are pretty rare I imagine.

One of the problems I find is that there is a list of potential treatments as long as my arm but how many will really work and can I afford to bankrupt myself trying them all out? For that reason I think it makes most sense to stick as far as possible with treatments that have at least some kind of medical support in relation to Peyronies.

So true. I am like it or not in this for the long haul. Sticking with proven therapies makes the most sence.