Injury/ Trauma peyronies V gradual ( stealth ) peyronies

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Fix This

Hi all

My peyronies was brought on by a very definite incident where I cracked my erect penis ( fractured although not confirmed by hthe Doc I saw at the time ). within 24 hours of this I could feel scar tissue which would of course lead to my curvature and hourglassing etc. I realise that a lot of men and members here develop peyronies without any such memorable incident

I'm wondering whether trauma peyronies is generally harder or easier to treat than gradual peyronies? Or whether trauma peyronies appears to respond better to certain treatments than gradual peyronies or vice versa?

May be something worth thinking about when considering where to go next with treatment

Thanks y' all
47 , penis trauma July 2018 leading to Peyronies. 30-40 degree dorsal curvature, narrowing after plaque. 

I'm attacking it though, and I will fix this!

VED, traction, DMSO, Ultrasound, Acupuncture, meds, herbs

james1947

As someone on the forum for 9 years I can't see any difference between trauma caused Peyronies or Peyronies developed without any trauma.
Maybe saying "without any trauma" is wrong and maybe many small or "micro-traumas" during time accumulating to be a trauma. Maybe.

James  
Age 71, Peyronies from Jan 2009 following penis fracture during sex. Severe ED.
Lost 2" length and a lot of girth. Late start, still VED, Cialis & Pentox helped. Prostate surgery 2014.
Got amazing support on the forum

Fix This

Thanks James1947

That's exactly right. Those without known or conscious major trauma to the penis are thought to have these ' micro traumas ' that lead to peyronies, rather than a major incident which clearly led to peyronies.

I'm interested in whether some treatments might prove more effective for trauma peyronies or for micro trauma peyronies. This may not be something that most people have considered to any great extent, or even the practitioners themselves have thought about. It may indeed be a question for the practitioners and urologists rather than ourselves.

But it would seem to me that the trauma caused by a sudden, painful and audible penis fracture would leave a larger tear in the tunicea albuginea than a micro tear that the man is not aware of ? And hence trigger a stronger over production of collagen as the body's defense mechanism?  

Having said that it's possible that those with micro trauma peyronies have more of a natural propensity to overproduce the collagen, hence the fact that they were not aware of it.

Just voicing my thoughts really, and wondered whether anyone had any links to studies or articles about this.On that note, I'll have a google myself!

Thanks James1947

47 , penis trauma July 2018 leading to Peyronies. 30-40 degree dorsal curvature, narrowing after plaque. 

I'm attacking it though, and I will fix this!

VED, traction, DMSO, Ultrasound, Acupuncture, meds, herbs

Hawk

It is important to remember that developing scar tissue at the site of a fracture is NOT Peyronies Disease.  It is nothing more than normal healing just like scar tissue at the site of a surgical incision or a badly mangled arm.

Regardless of the extent of the injury, Peyronies Disease is when scar tissue formation does not turn off and overruns healthy uninjured tissue.
Prostatectomy 2004, radiation 2009, currently 70 yrs old
After pills, injections, VED - Dr Eid, Titan 22cm implant 8/7/18
Hawk - Updated 10/27/18 - Peyronies Society Forums

Nocekgari

Hello fix this and  James and Hawk. I have exactly the same injury and I was wondering the same thing. Although my fracture happened 3 months ago, curvature started to develop recently. There was an audible pop, no hematoma, no swelling. Therefore I didnt get surgery. But for the last couple of weeks, my penis leans to the left, especcialy in flaccid state. I can actually feel there is a force that causes my penis to lean that way. During erections though, my congenital curvature is increasing slowly, but weird thing is, it sometimes doesnt show itself and I only see my congenital curve. As Hawk said, scar tissue itself is not peyronies,  but it can still cause curvature. As far as I know, this type of curve is easier to correct as long as there is no plaque development. Biggest problem is, nobody know why and how a scar or healed fracture turnes into plaques. If there is an explanation, I will be glad to be enlightened.  
25 year old with penile fracture. Fracture happened on May 30. No surgery, only conservative treatment. Uro thinks it was not a big one. No ED, no peyronies so far. Doctor says Peyronies Disease is possible. Constant penile pain, turtling, hard flaccid.

Fix This

Hi Hawk

I'm not entirely sure if that is the generally accepted definition of peyronies disease.  That the scar tissue does not turn off and overruns the healthy tissue? It would seem that any scar tissue/ plaque that forms within the penis and causes curvature, hourlgassing, deformity, shrinkage etc would be considered as peyronies whether the formation has been judged to have not switched off or not ?  

Anyway , if we are to take this view that Peyronies Disease is when scar tissue formation does not turn off and overruns healthy uninjured tissue. Then the same question applies as to whether more overrun scar tissue formation is released by the body after an injury trauma rather than a micro  trauma? And also whether any treatments are more or less effective for those with trauma induced peyronies or micro trauma induced peyronies

The reason that I'm asking this is to identify the best choices for future treatment of my condition. And the same could possibly apply to all of those of us that developed peyronies as a result of a known trauma. And vice versa for those that developed peyronies as a result of microtraumas.  

It would seem that we all have the same wound healing disorder regardless of whether it was trauama or microtrauma. It just may be that one type of peyronies reacts better to certain treatments than the other. And that is what I'm questioning
47 , penis trauma July 2018 leading to Peyronies. 30-40 degree dorsal curvature, narrowing after plaque. 

I'm attacking it though, and I will fix this!

VED, traction, DMSO, Ultrasound, Acupuncture, meds, herbs

Pfract

Fix this: I am 100% with hawk on this. Also, on just 24hours i would say it's impossible to feel scar tissue from a penile fracture. Your wound didn't even had the time yet to heal.  And if you cracked your erect penis, how can this not be confirmed by your urologist? Did you had bruising or hematoma?

Fix This

Hi pfract

I'm not sure what you're saying you're 100% with Hawk on. But just to clarify - I'm wondering whether trauma peyronies is generally harder or easier to treat than gradual peyronies? Or whether trauma peyronies appears to respond better to certain treatments than gradual peyronies or vice versa?

I'm not questioning whether there is a difference between peyronies scar tissue and any non peyronies scar tissue in the penis, or whether there is such a thing. That is a question for another thread , but not what I was asking

With regards to my injury that led to my peyronies. It happened in Dublin where I was staying for just one Sunday night, before flying to the USA the following Monday morning where I was working for a week. Probably happened about 1am. Had attended A&E by about 3-4am. The Doctor that I saw at that time ( not a urologist ) said he thought that there was no penile fracture as there was no bleeding or bruising at that time. Despite the snapping sound and immediate loss of erection. He said it was probably ' ligament damage '

By the time I was on the plane the following day, I could feel some tissue starting to build up inside my penis. And within the next day or so I could feel the clump of scar tissue inside my penis and the feeling that it was no longer ' in one piece ' . I'm sure may of you have experienced this feeling

The urologists that I saw since have said that it was most likely a penile fracture,and that penile fractures do not always bruise externally or lead to blood in the urine. This may be difficult to confirm after the event. But what is not difficult to confirm id the fact that because of thsi incident I now have peyronies. A 30-40 degree curve, and hourglassing, ED problems, loss of sexual and to somne extent personal confidence. All of this we are familiar with I'm sure. However I'm ploughing on as we all are

But again, the question in my thread is not whether I sustained a penis fracture or not that night when I snapped my penis . And it's not how quickly my scar tissue developed. The question I was asking is whether trauma peyronies is generally harder or easier to treat than gradual peyronies? Or whether trauma peyronies appears to respond better to certain treatments than gradual peyronies or vice versa?
47 , penis trauma July 2018 leading to Peyronies. 30-40 degree dorsal curvature, narrowing after plaque. 

I'm attacking it though, and I will fix this!

VED, traction, DMSO, Ultrasound, Acupuncture, meds, herbs

Fix This

And in relation to your question about why I wasn't diagnosed with a penis fracture pfract. I believe that I was misdiagnosed and that the general A&E Doc did not investigate properly ( possibly as I'd mentioned that I ha d aflight to catch to the USA a few later that morning). I believe that if it had been dealt with correctly at the time ( probably would have meant degloving) then I would not have developed the excess scar tissue and hence the peyronies
47 , penis trauma July 2018 leading to Peyronies. 30-40 degree dorsal curvature, narrowing after plaque. 

I'm attacking it though, and I will fix this!

VED, traction, DMSO, Ultrasound, Acupuncture, meds, herbs

Fix This

Hi Nocekgari

Yes well it would seem that all of us that have Peyronies have this excessive scar tissue formation. So if we injure our penises as we have, then that leads to peyronies as the scar tissue / collagen production goes into overdrive

I'm not sure at what point the scar tissue becomes classified as a plaque. I was ubnder the impression that as soon as it's formed and started to cause these problems the it is a plaque. And that there is then just the difference between calcified and non calcified plaques, in terms of which is more difficult to treat ( calcified ).

This standard definition of peyronies suggests that the scar tissue and plaque are the same thing
https://www.webmd.com/men/peyronies-disease#1

Anyway, we digress again I feel. I am still wondering whether trauma peyronies is generally harder or easier to treat than gradual peyronies? Or whether trauma peyronies appears to respond better to certain treatments than gradual peyronies or vice versa?

Apologies for copying and pasting my original question again. It's just everyone seems to be going off on tangents and changing the questions. ...maybe I should just google my question!

Anyway have a good day/ night / whatever all

Cheers


47 , penis trauma July 2018 leading to Peyronies. 30-40 degree dorsal curvature, narrowing after plaque. 

I'm attacking it though, and I will fix this!

VED, traction, DMSO, Ultrasound, Acupuncture, meds, herbs