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[StraightAgain]

Many doctors actually recommend taking over 5,000 iu's of Vitamin D3 daily. I currently take 12,000 iu's daily, and have for over a year. You are 100% correct regarding immune system boost it gives you. I have not once been sick since starting this regimen. Many tests currently are being conducted regarding Peyronie's treatments with Vitamin D3. One major study will be released in 2013. You can read more about it in my sig. In short, Vitamin D is highly recommended in higher iu's for Peyronie's relief. Studies are already showing positive results, and not to mention the benefits of a strong immunity. This is key for your body to fight off things, such as built up scar tissues it can't dissolve on its own. Do your research, Google search 'Vitamin D Peyronies Disease', many things are pointing to it as being a real solution.

Hope this helps! 

THIS USER IS PERMANENTLY BANNED!  He is a: Peyronies Disease supplement RIPOFF SPAMMER

[j]

The 'new theory' definitely caught my interest when I first saw it, and there may be connections between some form of vitamin D and fibrosis.   But there are probably light-years separating that sort of speculation from an effective treatment.

If we didn't know anything about cars, we might eventually conclude that cars that ran badly tended to leave dirty oil on the pavement and emit blue smoke. We'd infer that cars need oil, and that clean oil is somehow important. So we'd buy cans of oil and set them under the hood...

[George999]

I have been taking 1,000 IU of Vitamin D for months now and it has neither made my Peyronies Disease better or worse.  But it has certainly been helpful to my immune system.  I would recommend *sane* amounts of Vitamin D to anyone.  Its a very beneficial supplement.  The one problem related to it is the fact that a person can have metabolic issues that cause their body to break down the vitamin D supplement into calcium which can saturate the blood stream with calcium if they are taking to much of it.  That is the primary reason that some doctors urge caution in taking mega amounts (more than 2,000 IU per day) of Vitamin D.  But there is no evidence that it can be helpful in the case of Peyronies.  The most beneficial dietary steps I have discovered in dealing with Peyronies have to do with lowering blood sugar as much as possible.  - George

[Kyle]

So has anyone been using Vit D now and in the past that still have Peyronies Disease?
I noticed more and more stories coming out on lack of Vit D being the cause of many things.


First time here and first post so sorry if I seem out of touch here.

[George999]

People often blame genetic issues for their afflictions.  But ... the more we learn, the more we find that WE can CHANGE OUR OWN GENETIC MAKEUP!  - George

Healthy lifestyle triggers genetic changes: study

Comprehensive lifestyle changes including a better diet and more exercise can lead not only to a better physique, but also to swift and dramatic changes at the genetic level, U.S. researchers said on Monday.

[George999]

I found this recent article quite interesting and thought that I should share it:

Advanced glycation endproducts (AGEs) may be a fact of life, but fighting them may extend your life

How and Why to Prevent AGE Damage

[George999]

Post removed by author.  The substance of this post made no sense.  It was a stupid error on my part.  My apologies.  - George

[AR]

Welcome to the PDS forum Rejoice.

Old Man, my daughter complains of cramps and tingling in her legs after sitting on our toilet.  I've never experienced this or what you describe, but I vehemently believe western toilets (and their seats) are an aberration of design.

For other reasons, I actually lift the seat and sit on the bowl's rim, which lowers my butt a little and makes my visit more comfortable.  To do this you have to live in a house with only girls, and in the winter it can be a real eye opener..!  In my youth I had one of those "cushioned" seats which was very soft.

My best,

AR

[Hawk]

Welcome to the PDS forum Rejoyce.  Hopefully you will find and be able to share some helpful information here.  Do not overlook the Ladies room.  You are welcome to post in either place.

Your husband is fortunate to have a supportive wife.  I do have to say that your hunch about small toilet seats is certainly new.  I think it safe to say that there is no supporting evidence or sound theory on how this could ever cause Peyronies Disease.  In view of the fact that small toilet seats are the norm, it also does not explain why 90% of the men that use them never get Peyronies Disease.  I strongly suspect that there were other issues going on to explain the pain.  It is also possible that the toilet seat experience only revealed a problem rather than caused the problem.

Welcome again and try to encourage your husband to sign on as well.

Hawk

[rejoyce]

I have a theory that too small of toilet seats causes pressure on the penis and contributed to my husband's peyronies.  My husband would get up from sitting on the toilet with pain in his penis from the pressure (which  he never thought to complain about until he researched his peyronies symptoms).  Now we have a oblong toilet seat and are hoping with the other efforts we are making (Vit E, verapamil cream and lowering blood sugar) that we'll see improvement.

[George999]

Great job Tim!  Every little step will pay huge dividends in the end.  But it is not easy for any of us in a world that conspires against us from the grocery store to the office and everywhere in between.  But weight loss that is temporary is useless.  Unfortunately, most typical calorie driven diets are a long term disaster for most of their practitioners who tend to move from one fad diet to another.  Better to take it slow and steady.  And to a certain degree, it can actually get easier as one works his way along.  And I would not give up on the testosterone.  It seems that we may actually see Cardiac Peptide Hormones being prescribed within three years if the early trials go well.  Three to five years is not so long a time.  The fly in the ointment at this point is the fact that these peptides can not be administered orally since the body does not absorb them intact.  They have to be given by infusion.  The search is for a medication that will stimulate the heart to produce them.  But who knows what the future may bring?  As always, I wish you all the best!  - George

[Tim468]

Interesting links George,

I am grateful for your contributions to this board. I made the relatively simple changes of making my breakfast and lunch following your advice - and I have lost weight!

I am down from 200 to 193, and I am doing virtually NOTHING differently, simply eating mixed fruit i the morning with some dry cereal on it, and usually eating a homemade salad for lunch (sometimes I forget).

I took the approach that too much change would not be sustained by me (I know me well...) and that if I could make one small change, and stick with it, I would move on to a second change. So, I started with the fruit salad for breakfast, and added the veggie salad for lunch after a successful two weeks.

Now I am working on changing two dinner meals a week, and integrating a modest amount of walking (I am now walking up 2 or less flights of stairs and down 3 or less, and walking about 10 minutes a day in addition to my normal walking around. I am also deliberately parking farther away form the front of stores (though some probably think I am one of *those* guys who try to protect their new paint jobs).

Progress. It feels good. I am hopeful that the start of a simple exercise program will yield benefits. I am still quite concerned about my testosterone levels being not just too low, but beyond rescue. If not, I will take supplemetal T -we shall see.

Take care, Tim

[George999]

I think it is important to add that conventional sugars have their risks as well.  They are not naturally occurring, but rather have been refined down to a concentrated form and definitely will support weight gain and push up insulin levels.  While certainly a reasonable amount certainly would not be harmful to a healthy individual, I, personally with rare exceptions where I am socially obligated in the extreme, have cut all sweetener intake from my diet, including both artificial AND natural sweeteners.  After doing this for a while, I am discovering that even the smallest amounts of sweetener of any kind stimulate my hunger pangs.  - George

[George999]

Old Man, We now have MULTIPLE studies indicating a link between consumption of artificial sweeteners and weight gain.  At the same time, our obesity rate as a nation has only worsened as artificial sweeteners have become more popular.  I am convinced that artificial sweeteners are going to end up paralleling trans-fats in terms of health implications.  We know that excessive saturated fat is unhealthy.  But we also know that there is NO safe amount of trans-fats.  Similarly, we know that excessive consumption of refined sugars is unhealthy.  But now we are finding out that artificial sweeteners may very well be even worse in terms of health effects.  The bottom line is that there is no simple solution to the problem.  That is why more and more people are lining up for heart surgery and more and more people are ending up with diabetes at a younger and younger age.  I am becoming increasingly convinced that the only safe sweets are natural UNREFINED fruit based foods and the only safe fats are natural UNREFINED plant based fats, both consumed in moderation.  The purpose of food is to nourish the body, but in our society eating has become the basis for social interaction and an almost recreational endeavor.  And I am also convinced that all of this has a huge impact on Peyronies.   In short, our addiction to food is making us sick and causing us to die prematurely.  But for most of the population this is not too high of a price to pay.  These are my sentiments on the matter.  - George

PS - This whole thing has been something of a reality check in our own family.  We actually have at least one of those huge warehouse store packages of Splenda sitting around that has gone unopened for a year now since all of this data started leaking out.  Who knows where that box will end up.  But unless information comes out to convincingly refute these new findings, it will most certainly not end up in our stomachs.  Of that I can assure you.  I think this is something every family has to think through after laying out the cards on the table.  How much of a price, in terms of our health, are we willing to pay for the privilege of enjoying our food?

[George999]

Yet another study implicates artificial sweeteners as promoters of weight gain ...

"There's something about diet foods that changes your metabolic limit, your brain chemistry," said ABC News' medical contributor Dr. Marie Savard.

http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/story?id=4271246&page=1

A lot of people are just ignoring the obvious in their pursuit of fairy tale solutions.

- George

[George999]

Hitman, If you have been lifting weights for two years, then I would do the minimal amount of weight lifting required to maintain your muscle mass which means not challenging yourself to gain more at this point.  You don't want to stress your body to the point that you set off the Cortisol thing because that is going to be counter productive.  So whatever weight level you are at now, you can back it up to the point that it is only minimally stressful and concentrate on the cardio side and the diet and drop the weight. That will put you in a position to put on the weight in terms of additional muscle mass once you get the fat off.  The fat this is really messing you up is the omentum fat that is inside your abdomen.  This is the fat that is mechanically stressing your body and organs and at the same time, poisoning them chemically.  Blowing away that fat will really revolutionize your health.  The "You on a Diet" book by doctors Roizen and Oz will show you how to make that happen.  - George

[Hitman]

so diet + cardio first then weight-lifting later. I only enquire about weight-lifting because I used to weight-lift in the pass and I just don't want to lose a considerable amount of muscle mass which I've trained for 2 years to pack on- although my diet will obviously help in that regards-

regarding walking yeah thats no problem. Incline walking on the treadmill I used to do for some time. HIT cardio or interval training I've read to be superior than regular cardio for fat loss, but thats too harsh considering my weight at the moment.

I wanted to buy a treadmill but the ones in the gym are wider and bigger and more comfortable to use and since I have a gym membership I will be doing all my cardio over there.

anyhow thanks for your advice.

[George999]

Hitman, My thoughts are that ANYTHING that LOADS your body would probably be inappropriate right now.  You should be doing AT LEAST 30 minutes of walking EVERY day.  More is better, up to an hour a day, after that the benefits decline.  Too accomplish this you need to work up to it.  Start where you are now, add another five minutes to your walks every few days to you reach 30 minute to an hour.  For a long time I walked outdoors daily.  When the weather was inclimate, I walked round and round the mall.  You sort of have to make do with what you have.  Now I have a treadmill and I try to do 20 minutes EVERY morning and another 20 minutes EVERY evening.  I do programs on the treadmill.  But that is not how I started with the treadmill.  I started walking flat at a comfortable pace.  As that became easier, which it did, I GRADUALLY pushed up the pace.  When the pace started growing too rapid for comfort, I started racking up the incline.  When that become easy, I moved on to the programs that dynamically alter the pace and incline.  This will help to crank up your metabolism and shed the pounds.  This concept is called "muscle confusion" and it works both on an aerobic level and on a resistance level.  But forget sled dragging for now.  That is nearly the equivalent of resistance exercise and is not likely to accomplish for you what you need.  What you need most right now is to get the right NUTRIENT DENSE food and lots of motion.  The more you can keep your body in motion the better.  The answer is NOT in cutting calories.  People who zealously cut calories end up malnourishing themselves and actually damage their bodies in the process.  The answer is a balanced, nutrient dense diet that scrupulously avoids those foods that cause and increase hunger and includes appropriate amounts of those foods that satiate hunger and crank up your metabolism.  Once you get in the groove with this strategy (right foods and routine walking), your pounds should fall off in a very healthy way.  Even many of the doctors don't really understand this.  When my weight dropped precipitously, my doc was very concerned since he was accustomed in seeing this happen in either people who are sick or people who are doing extreme calorie restriction, either case being dangerous.  So it was really a new experience for him to observe me losing significant amounts of weight while not only retaining, but actually enhancing my health.  Once you get this down and get your circumference around your navel down close to your circumference around your hips (this is the gold standard), THEN will be a good time to start to work in a routine of resistance exercises using techniques like muscle confusion.  It will THEN also be a good time to start to work in appropriate supplements.  But right now you need to do smart, consistent, and easy, picking up the challenge little by little as you work your way along.  I know this SOUNDS like I am trying to hold you back, but if you eat right and get yourself moving, you should be able to move on to the things you want to include in a matter of months.  Its not a matter of hard work, but you need to get your technique right if you want to be surprised by success.

- George

[Hitman]

thanks george

yeah I think I'm very out of shape and have poor conditioning. what are you thoughts on sled dragging?

as for weight-lifting I'm going to ease into it very slowly.

thanks

[George999]

I am thinking that there is probably enough evidence out there at this point to consider renaming this thread to something like:

Possible Metabolic Factors, Diet, Exercise, Etc.

Any thoughts on this anyone?  I think the current title is discouraging/confusing people from posting here.  It was appropriate initially but is probably overdue for an update.


- George

[George999]

1)  Hawk, I suggest that these non-ED posts probably fit best under the topic of "A New Theory on Cause and Treatment of Peyronie's Disease".  Somehow, none of us seem to like posting there, but that would seem to be the place where these posts would fit best.

2)  Hitman, Thumbs up on the thyroid test, seems like that would be a good issue to rule out.  The Cortisol thing is a little trickier.  The problem with measuring Cortisol accurately is sort of like the problem of tracking Insulin levels in that Cortisol levels are dynamic and one test likely won't tell you a whole lot.  It can be in the normal range and yet be shooting out of the normal range enough to cause you problems.  Cortisol levels tend to respond to stress.  In many ways Cortisol is controlled similarly to Insulin.  The body releases Cortisol in order to stimulate its Cortisol receptors.  The amount of Cortisol released is governed by a sort of biological feedback system, again making use of receptors.  If you have a Cortisol resistance condition, your body will release more Cortisol on stimulus to accomplish the intended function.  This can pose problems in that that elevated level of Cortisol can (and does) have effects quite unrelated to Cortisol receptor stimulation.  For example, elevated levels of Cortisol can result in weight gain even though the receptors being resistant are not being overly stimulated.  This happens through other paths.  Another effect of elevated Cortisol levels is that they overload what is known as the Cortisol/Cortisone shuttle in the kidneys and end up stimulating the Aldosterone receptors in the kidney which can not distinguish between Cortisol and Aldosterone.  This results in all kinds of problems.  My personal belief is that Cortisol problems are an integral part of Metabolic Syndrome.  But you need to know this.  Most of the Diet Supplement "Cortisol cures" really don't work very well if at all.  Valerian works because it depresses the Central Nervous System which is what triggers elevated Cortisol levels in the first place.  But it is far from ideal since it tends to make you drowsy and spacey.  Thats why I am switching to Bacopa which is believed to have a healing effect on the nervous system.  So I can tell you that while Cortisol is a problem, it, like Peyronies and ED is not an easy one to address.  My advise is to concentrate on something that should be easier to address right now, which is the need to get your weight under control.  One thing I can also tell you is that when you do resistance exercises like weight lifting, you are going to stress your body in a way that will cause it to release Cortisol.  That is probably why your heart is racing and you are feeling fatigued.  What your body really needs right now is a REASONABLE level of aerobic exercise like treadmill or elliptical or exercise bike type stuff.  Doing this REGULARLY for a few weeks will do wonders for your cardiovascular capacity and get your resting heart rate down.  There is plenty of time for the resistance stuff later.  The resistance stuff builds muscle and thats good because it helps in getting the weight down.  But its not the best place to start.  Number one should be DIET, DIET, DIET.  You need to get the book.  It is much to deep to tell you everything over the forum and the authors are top doctors who are specialists in weight loss and have been sponsored by the big HMO United Health Care.  And they offer a website WITH a forum where you can get answers from medical professionals.  Number two is the cardio.  It is extremely important.  You do not need to kill yourself with either diet or exercise, but you need to approach both with knowledge and do them smart and easy and I think you will be amazed at the results.  By the way, Ninja's advice is right on the mark in this regard.  Lots of people DIE on treadmills because they have a lot of zeal but lack knowledge.  A little bit of exercise done right can do wonders for you.  OVERexercising can be counter  productive and can even kill you.  One of the things the docs mention in the book is that for some people, appropriate aerobic exercise is simply getting up from the couch a few times in succession.  I know that this was partly in jest, but you get the point.  You have to start at a reasonable beginning point.  Resistance exercise like weightlifting ELEVATES Cortisol levels.  Aerobic exercise like walking LOWERS Cortisol levels.  If you have a Cortisol issue, and I suspect you probably do, appropriate aerobic exercise will address BOTH your weight AND your Cortisol issues.  And, of course, as several posters have advised, be very cautious about accepting advice from people who are selling.  They might have a bit of a conflict of interest in terms of the quality of the advice they are giving.  SIGH ... Testosterone is also another issue for people with Metabolic Syndrome which tend to be associated with lower Testosterone levels.  Here again, there are things like Tongkat Ali that might potentially address that.  But you have to be careful not to get the cart before the horse.  SMART DIET + SMART EXERCISE = DEPENDABLE WEIGHT LOSS, and that equation will do wonders for you.

I wish you the best,

George

[Hitman]

I'm not a physician, but I guess the advice of George is good, and carefulness of Liam is good. Don't trust a site where they sell you stuff, the info is usually biased.

yeah that is what i was thinking too.

Quote reduced per the rules in "Read This First".  Quotes should not repeat entire posts
Hawk

[ninjagaiden]

Dear All,

I'm not a physician, but I guess the advice of George is good, and carefulness of Liam is good. Don't trust a site where they sell you stuff, the info is usually biased.

If you're overweight, go to a doctor (or a sports physician) and ask what you can do and what you should avoid. There might be many reasons why you feel depleted after a workout session, but the fast heart beat should be during the session not 10 minutes after, I think it's not normal...

The more out of shape you are the lower the intensity of the training should be.
It you're stressed up, consider relaxation, meditation, massages...
Do long sessions (walking, slow running, swimming) in order to get in better shape before considering weightlifting. That's just my advice.

I've read so many books about fitness, nutrition, injuries-recovery methods, and I can tell you one thing that I learned out of this huge pile of contradictory methods:
"Don't ask your body more than he can give". Go slow, pay attention to your body's signals, use your common sense, or you'll get injured in the long run.

You'll have time enough to increase the intensity when your body's ready.

Or don't listen to me, but at least listen to a specialized doctor 
I'm just saying that to people really overweight and who haven't practiced for a while. You can't get back in shape in one week (like they say in the magazines, next to the supplements page), if it took 5-10 years to your body to get out of shape.

[Liam]

Hitman,

 I am just a little leery of accepting anything that comes from a site trying to sell something.

I'm not saying you are wrong.  Do you have any info from the more established medical community?

[Hitman]

I don't think people like Dr Shippen or Dr Mariano  are ''unqualified medical practitioners''. I'm surprised that some doctors still choose to ignore this issue. http://www.lef.org/protocols/prtcl-002.shtml#adrenalfatigue

anyhow ......

A question to George. Do you know what might be the reason for a very fast heart beat after a weight-lifting session. it seems one set drains my energy very badly.

Quote of entire post immediately previous to this post was deleted

Hawk

[Liam]

Here is a quote from a Mayo Clinic article:

It's frustrating to have persistent symptoms your doctor can't readily explain. But accepting a medically unrecognized diagnostic label from an unqualified practitioner could be worse. Unproven remedies for so-called "adrenal fatigue" may leave you feeling sicker, while a treatable condition — such as depression or fibromyalgia — continues to take its toll.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/adrenal-fatigue/AN01583

Something to consider.  Sorry to play devil's advocate.

Liam

[Hitman]

And what has helped me most in getting to this point is not just the supplements, but the diet and exercise process that is helping me knock down Metabolic Syndrome X.  I am also taking supplements to attack the Metabolic Syndrome and am convinced that that is positively helping me with the Peyronies.  Over and over in the past I have tried to lose weight.  Only recently have I discovered how to lose weight effortlessly (at least for me).  And I know that losing weight and getting my blood glucose levels down, down, down is doing great things in terms of my Peyronies problem.  I suspect it would be even more helpful for an ED problem.

hey George

many thanks for that. I'm pretty much in the same boat. I have metabolic syndrome X and I'm starting very soon. my main problem was university. now I'm doing my diploma part-time so I have time for my own self. on interesting point you mentioned is adrenal issues. I will be doing some blood tests this week for thyroid- because it runs in the family and because it might impede my fat loss regime- as for the adrenals I suspect I have adrenal fatigue and so I might have to do a saliva cortisol test on my own. what are your advises with regards to the adrenal issue.

thanks

Edited to remove a massive quote that repeated an entire post.  Only the quote was edited
Hawk

[Kimo]

George,,,,that was an excellent post on diet and exercise,,thank you..YOur right on......Keep up the good work.......

kimo

[George999]

Hello Hitman,

Welcome to our little exclusive club!  (We should be so fortunate to qualify, right?)  I just want to pass on a few thoughts.  I am taking a humongous number of supplements. You don't even want to know how many.  Of all of them, I, personally, have gotten the best results from Broad Spectrum E, Horny Goat Weed, Maca and SAN VasoFlow.  Those are the ones that have given me what I consider obvious quantifiable results in terms of Peyronies.  But I also take a lot of supplements just because there is research out there that indicates they MIGHT be helpful.

However, at this point, I am really doing better in terms of Peyronies than ever since I have had the problem.  I am doing great both psychologically and physiologically.  I am even beginning to sense some possible improvement on the deformity front as if the fibrotic tissue itself is softening some.  The palpable plaques have shrunk to almost nothing and the next battle is going to be to deal with the deformity itself.  And what has helped me most in getting to this point is not just the supplements, but the diet and exercise process that is helping me knock down Metabolic Syndrome X.  I am also taking supplements to attack the Metabolic Syndrome and am convinced that that is positively helping me with the Peyronies.  Over and over in the past I have tried to lose weight.  Only recently have I discovered how to lose weight effortlessly (at least for me).  And I know that losing weight and getting my blood glucose levels down, down, down is doing great things in terms of my Peyronies problem.  I suspect it would be even more helpful for an ED problem.

The big thing in achieving the weight loss is diet and exercise.  For diet guidance I recommend the book "YOU on a Diet" by Oz and Roizen published by Free Press.  This is a VERY non-traditional diet book that focuses on educating you on what effect various food products have on your metabolism.  Once you internalize this information, you can pretty much guarantee yourself weight loss from the moment you set foot in the grocery store to do your food shopping.  It is not how many calories you consume, but WHAT you put in your fridge that will ultimately determine your waist size.  And my experience is that getting your waist size down can cause a HUGE positive impact on your health in general.  You will feel better, look better, have more energy, the benefits I have experienced have been huge.  They also talk about exercise.  In my case, I hang out a lot at bodybuilding.com and pick up a lot of tips there.  They (bodybuilding.com) also have good tips on weight loss supplements.

About a year ago I purchased a high quality treadmill.  It was one of the best purchases of my life.  I hear that ellipticals are also good.  Most of my exercise has been twenty minutes two times per day on that treadmill, usually a cardio program in the morning and an interval program at night.  In my case I have gone from difficult to control hypertension on three prescription meds to perfectly normal blood pressure with no meds in a matter of months.

I also take some supps to help with the weight loss.  They are Forskolin, Flax Oil, Fish Oil, Sesamin, CLA, ALC, Bacopa (to address adrenal issues) and Valerian formulas to address adrenal issues via CNS depression.  I also am making sure I get Grapeseed Oil, Canola Oil, Olive Oil and Sesame Oil in my diet (I mix them myself, 3 parts Grapeseed, 1 part Canola, and a bit of Olive and Sesame).  I am planning to add ALA for insulin sensitivity and Tongkat Ali to try to tweak up my Testosterone levels.  Also some additional stuff to work on my insulin sensitivity a bit further.  The big hitters on the diet side are Fats, Sugars, Flours and Starches.  Fats are extremely important.  Getting the right amounts of the right fats can HELP you to lose weight.  But use moderation with saturated fats and corn based fats and get trans fats out of your life 100%.  The natural sweetness of fruits is good for you and will help you with your weight loss project, but refined sugars of all sorts are bad news.  Also beware of no-calorie alternative sweeteners.  ALL except the fiber based ones will make you fat regardless of what the 'experts' claim.  And as much as possible you need to get flours and starches out of your diet in all of their forms.  Ezekiel bread is the only bread option I have found that is really helpful in achieving weight loss.  And the only starchy food I will touch are Sweet Potatoes IN MODERATION.  Once you get the right combination together, your appetite will diminish and the pounds will fall off.  There are extremely few people who need to resort to surgery.  The book also discusses this angle.  The authors indicate that they only advise it for the "morbidly obese".

I wish you the best!

George

[George999]

Hawk, I would agree with you 100%.  I did overstate this thing a little much.  By way of explanation, I did have a rare (for me) resurgence that I at a point in time, by making various connections, attributed to sugar.  By pointedly dealing with that issue, I saw an immediate reversal of that resurgence and a very marked retreat in the plaques to almost nothing.  The daily ebb and flow that I have observed also fits this pattern.  The plaques seem more pronounced in the evening and virtually gone in the morning.  This would seem to correspond with rising and falling blood glucose levels.  My strategy over time is to gradually reduce those levels.  However, I do sometimes get caught up in my own experiences and carried away with it all.  I apologize for the poorly chosen words.  They are undoubtedly out of proportion to the reality.  Thanks again for stepping in with some common sense.  - George

A discussion about George's statement concerning observable daily changes in plaque ensued in the "Progression of Peyronies Disease" topic,  Click the link below for that discussion

[Hawk]

George,

I appreciate your source post on elastin.  It was informative and a generally interesting piece.

Among a few statement you made in another post, this one caught my eye.
 

So at this point, I am gaining more traction out of this strategy than out of Vitamin E, the only other strategy that has proven useful to me over an extended period of time.  I am not sure that this will lead to a cure, but in my case, it has certainly brought the disease to a grinding halt.

As one who advocates the possible validity of this theory, I respectfully think your observations require you to qualify you statement, such as: "At this point I seem to be more stable since I have started this strategy than while using any of my previous strategies."   With the limited period of time, and one person's observations, all we know is that your Peyronies Disease ebbs and flows.  You are are applying this strategy.  During this period your Peyronies Disease is not progressing.  There can be no definitive way to connect these two at this point.

I know a person that was an undiagnosed bipolar for many years.  They knew something was not right and that no doctor was helping them.  They researched, hypoglycemia.  It seemed to tie in with their highs, restlessness, irritability, insomnia, followed by crashes.  They concluded they would try a non hypoglycemic diet and TA DA, they improved.  It truly seemed a miracle.  Unfortunately within a couple months the problem was back and their research led them to another remedy which also seemed to work for a short time.  After years of many remedies that seemed to bring temporary results followed by disappointing failure, they were properly diagnosed.  They then realized that they were simply cycling from mania, to normal, to depression.  The cycling occurred with or without the remedies.  There was no connection.

I am well aware that you are informed enough to know these things but many who read your posts are not.  It is for this reason I make the point.  Maybe you need a signature line like financial institutions: "These conclusions are unverified. Your experience may differ significantly from my personal experience.  Results may vary" 

[George999]

Tim, this paper seems to imply that it is the Testosterone factor that is driving the Metabolic Syndrome.  IF that is the case, then the next obvious question is, what is driving the the Testosterone factor?  I would suggest that in light of the fact that Metabolic Syndrome is only lately found to be in epidemic proportions, that there is some modern day environmental driver behind it.  Here again, I would suggest diet to be a prime suspect.

Western diets that are high in animal sources as opposed to plant sources have been implicated in causing early puberty which suggests a direct link between diet and sex hormone levels.  Add to that fact that there seems to also be a link between this factor and things like risk for depression later in life and this whole thing becomes even more interesting.  In the case of depression, it has been suggested that diet modifications can do wonders.  I do not belong to the Adventist Church, but there are doctors, a local family practitioner among them, that are claiming a lot of people (90%+) are being 'cured' of depression using this guy's approach.

http://www.leavesoflife.org/dr-neil-nedley-uk-depression-way-out-proof-positive.htm

This is not to deny, of course, the role of genetic factors.  Genetic factors are huge.  They determine whether or not a person is SUSCEPTIBLE to a particular physiological malfunction.  But that does not mean that environmental factors are mute.  Often a change of environment, in this case in the form of diet, exercise and supplements, can potentially tip the balance and eliminate (normalize) the abnormal physiological state.  We cannot change our genes, but we can modify our environment.  This is the opportunity open to us that can improve our quality of life significantly and also deliver us from excessive dependence on prescription meds.

- George

[Tim468]

http://www.agingmale2004.com/transcript-Arver.htm

Click on "View Presentation" for a power point presentation with his voice lecturing.

There are other great presentations there too.

http://www.agingmale2004.com/

Tim

[George999]

The other part of the puzzle for me is the testosterone connection. You should check out the link recently provided by you for the Swedish guy and watch the presentation - it is fascinating and very informative.

Which link

Hawk, look at the Open Questions thread and check out my post #475.  I think its one of those links Tim is referencing.  Perhaps Tim can provide the direct link here in this thread for clarity.  - George

Thinking back to my own history, though, I note that I started to develop Peyronie's in my 20's when my body fat was at 8% and I was fit and had not any abnormalities in my triglycerides.  ...

The other part of the puzzle for me is the testosterone connection.

Tim

Tim, was Testosterone an issue for you when you first encountered Peyronies?  I suspect that their are multiple issues that can instigate fibrosis. I have been harping a bit lately on Metabolic Syndrome for two reasons.  One is that I believe it is the REALLY BIG instigator in our current culture, not only of fibrosis, but of all sorts of other serious health problems.  Second is that I believe that with what we know today, most people can not only control, but actually reverse Metabolic Syndrome if they make up their mind to do it, in ADDITION to the current practice of aggressively treating the symptoms only, and gain themselves huge health benefits in the process.  But certainly, as you assert, there have to be other factors, and indeed the Testosterone question is just begging to be explored.  In any case, I am thinking that it is time to move beyond the direct assault approach and begin to explore what it is that is going on in our underlying metabolism that is making us vulnerable to this issue in the first place.  That doesn't mean that we should not continue to use treatments that work, it only means we need to go beyond that and try to create an environment in which those treatments will work even better and in which the problem is less likely to recur if and when it is eliminated.  Certainly dealing with potential Testosterone issues have to be a part of that equation.  - George

[Hawk]

The other part of the puzzle for me is the testosterone connection. You should check out the link recently provided by you for the Swedish guy and watch the presentation - it is fascinating and very informative.

Which link

[Tim468]

Thanks for sharing this information. FWIW, I think that you are right - for many or most patients.

Thinking back to my own history, though, I note that I started to develop Peyronie's in my 20's when my body fat was at 8% and I was fit and had not any abnormalities in my triglycerides. However, now I am older, fatter and things are moving faster. So, I am going to work more avidly on this - especially the fitness component.

The other part of the puzzle for me is the testosterone connection. You should check out the link recently provided by you for the Swedish guy and watch the presentation - it is fascinating and very informative.

Tim

[George999]

Long ago in this thread, j asked a question about insulin resistance which was never really addressed by anyone.  I would like to take a shot at that.

Insulin is the substance in the blood that signals the cells to utilize glucose (sugar) from the blood.  It lets them know that there is available glucose in the blood and that they should be deriving their energy from it.  Insulin Resistance occurs when elevated non-fasting triglycerides (fat) in the blood cause the cells to ignore the Insulin and refuse to utilize the glucose.  This may or may not cause glucose to back up in the blood, but it will inevitably cause non-fasting insulin levels to rise in order to counter the effect of the excessive levels of non-fasting triglycerides.  People who are obviously obese are more prone to this syndrome than those who are not.  But those who are not obviously obese can be affected as well.  One reason is that even a slight amount of excess omental (inner-abdominal) fat can lead to this problem, such a slight excess of fat as to be unobservable to the casual observer.  And of course there are other possible explanations such as hormonal imbalances, etc, that might make for unique situations.  But for the most part, the problem is a buildup over time of omental fat.  And this syndrome known as Metabolic Syndrome, is unfortunately, due to diet and exercise aberrations, now taking root in pre-teens.  In extreme cases, Metabolic Syndrome results in problems like Diabetes, Hypertension, and other nasty afflictions.  The solution is to peel back the onion step by step.  Paring down the accumulated omental fat through a combination of healthy exercise and diet and appropriate supplements over time results in lowering of non-fasting serum triglyceride levels which results in rising insulin sensitivity which results in a decline in non-fasting serum insulin which results in a decline in systemic inflammation and on it goes.

- George

[George999]

Dear friends,

The theory that kicked this whole thread off almost two years ago attempted to tie Peyronies to blood glucose levels and insulin resistance.  With each passing day, I am even more convinced that this association is valid.  At this point, I am continuing to work on these issues in my own life and my Peyronies, while still very much present, is showing zero signs of life and even a few signs of progressive reversal.  While the deformities are still there, they are not getting any worse.  During the same period the plaques have all but disappeared although some tiny vestiges remain.  So at this point, I am gaining more traction out of this strategy than out of Vitamin E, the only other strategy that has proven useful to me over an extended period of time.  I am not sure that this will lead to a cure, but in my case, it has certainly brought the disease to a grinding halt.  Previously, the plaques would wax and wane for no apparent reason until I finally began to suspect a link between the waxing and waning of Peyronies and the possible waxing and waning of my blood glucose/insulin levels.  But now there is no longer waxing and waning, the Peyronies is stable over a period of weeks for the first time I can remember since the whole thing started.

My suggestions would be this:

Take a cloth measuring tape and let your gut hang out all the way while measuring yourself around at the navel at the point of the maximum measurement.  Record that number (N).  Now, using the same cloth tape, measure yourself around the hips, again at the point of largest measurement.  Record that number (H).  Now, calculate N/H=X.  If X is greater than 1, you are in trouble.  X should always be 1 or less.  X greater than 1 puts you at risk for all of the afflictions associated with Metabolic Syndrome and they are legion.

If you fail this test, I suggest you get yourself a copy of "You: On a Diet, The Owner's Manual for Waist Management" by Michael F Roizen, MD and Mehmet C Oz, MD.  This is a complete book dedicated to helping you get this equation right AND understanding the biology and physiology behind the problem.  It is a plan that, for most people, is effective and doable.  And you don't even have to work very hard to make it happen if you apply the information provided in this book.  In October of last year, I started with 40/36 or 1.11.  I am now at 36/36 or 1 (barely passing!).  I am still working at trying to bring it down further.  In addition to what I have learned from this book, I am also paying very close attention to controlling my sugar intake.  "Low glycemic" is the watchword and I also avoid sugar substitutes since they cause inordinate hunger (promoting weight gain) and can feed bacteria in the gut that promote weight gain.  I really enjoy ice cream, but now I limit my ice cream to one small serving per week.  And as I noted at the beginning of this post, this strategy has paid huge dividends in terms of controlling my Peyronies, not to mention the fact that it has totally eliminated my long standing (20+yr) affliction with hypertension.  In fact, I am planning to reduce my Vitamin E dosage from 800IU back down to 400IU within the next few weeks.  I have other issues with fibrosis that are significantly more scary than Peyronies, so it is very important for me to bring fibrosis to a halt.  This has to be what I consider one of the most promising strategies I have discovered to date to make this happen.

- George

[ofsho]

Hawk I do find the references to vitamin D particularly interesting. There is a deficiency across the world - I checked my levels a couple of weeks ago. Perhaps supplements like vitamin E are derided a bit, Peyronies Disease sufferers havent been impressed.But what I have come to figure so far is that antioxidants and nutrients work with each other better than drugs, for example vitamin C regenerates E. And D works well obviously with calcium but also with A and other minerals. Even to the point that these have to be teamed/ combined and are not remarkable in isolation.
Drugs are damaging,side effects imminenent I think thats fair to say, and nutrients/ supplements are often enough referred to as  cutting edge...
Well I actuallully havent started yet on anything, but the question looms large!!
Am considering vitamins A,E,D,omega3 and ALC, arginine,lipoic acid, coq10 even propolis I read that none of these are drugs.

[Hawk]

I have exchanged several emails with Kevin and invited him here as well.  He was friendly and helpful but had time demands that would not allow it (building a house).

I would like to keep it, I was just surprised that every one else seemed uninterested.  We will keep it a bit longer.  If it does not pick up interest, I like Phil's suggestion of merging it as individual posts within "Causes of Peyronies Disease".  If it ever picks up we can split it out again.

For those that missed it, here is the link.   www.dupuytrens-a-new-theory.com  There are several other interesting links in this topic.

[Joshua]

I would like to keep it as is, for a little longer if possible.. I have been meaning to look into this matter further. If you review the earlier posts on this thread I had contacted and invited a gentlemen to join the discussion from another site. He gave a great post in reply. The bottom line, if I recall was that he though vitamin D might help.. review the post from fibristow, its a good read...

[j]

Maybe it's a 'sleeper' and will turn out to be true, or at least close to the truth. The guy has obviously done some serious thinking and I think his ideas have credibility. Maybe this web site could have a link to the New Theory site.

[phil]

Hawk,

I think we should keep this, or at the very least move to "Causes."  Maybe rename the section "Theories" and combine with other similar ideas.

Phil

[Hawk]

I found this site and topic very interesting but apparently no one else has    It only generated a few posts and none in the past 8 months.

Should we pitch it?

[Glenn]

Thanks Frank.  Good luck and may God bless you. Never give up! 

Glenn

[fbristow]

Glenn,

Yes, calcitriol is available as a prescription drug (Rocaltrol is one of them). It comes in VERY small quantities, as it is a very powerful hormone (It's no longer considered a vitamin at this point).

Check out the following and free downloadable paper:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15371466&query_hl=11

Caveat: This may not work at all. I happen to have both Dupuytren's and what they (MD Anderson Cancer Center) say is a desmoid tumor (aggresssive fibromatosis) in my foot. I just happen to be convinved that they are CONNECTED- I believe it's a form of Ledderhose Disease. However, we may have to all get picket signs and stand outside some medical establishment to even get them to try it. Myself, at this point, (after going to MD Anderson, Vanderbilt, Harvard, Mayo Clinic, Temple University, and others), I'm considering calling one of these "Cancer Centers of America". I'll bet they'd be willing to try. My biggest problem is not the Dupuytren's. It's pain in my right foot that I've been dealing with for almost 5 years now.

Hope this helps.

Frank

[j]

I've read the "New Theory" web site before. While interesting, in the end I was left confused. I never could quite grasp the meaning of 'insulin sensitivity' versus 'insulin resistance', and I don't seem to fit the profile - I'm thin, in pretty good shape, not diabetic. 

After rereading it a couple of times I still couldn't figure out whether it meant our blood sugar is too high, too low, or what possible treatment the whole thing might suggest.

This is probably all due to my lack of patience, and understanding of how insulin functions. Maybe someone could do a better job of explaining it to me.

[Glenn]

Thanks for the info Frank.  I have never heard of D3 or calcitrol.  Is that available at the retail level?

Glenn                  

[fbristow]

Joshua,

I will share the info., but I don't know if we're on the right track or not, be it Dupuytren's, Peyronies, plantar fibromatosis, or anything else for that matter. But I hope and pray that we are close. Thing is, I am ABSOLUTELY convinced that the answer to this and most other diseases is "out there" somewhere. We just have to find it (and then-the hard part-convincing doctors to try something that they've never heard of before). I do know know that they are looking at all kinds of vitamin D analogues (especially ones that are anti-proliferative), but don't have the problems with hypercalcemia.

Frank

This is just a start, believe me, but Kevin is doing what very few people, researchers, or particularly physician's ever do. He is putting pieces of this puzzle together. I will be writing to Kevin directly, but let me tell everybody now- the answer to many, if not all "collagen-build-up" (my term) disorders MAY be in the "ACTIVE" form of vitamin D-calcitriol. Your kidneys and liver make this from oral or sunshine-derived vitamin D. There are papers out there now showing that giving this "active" form of vitamin D to patients (careful-it can be very toxic) can stop and reverse collagen fibrotic diseases. That's what I'll say for now, but I would have not even looked at this if it weren't for Kevin. God bless you.

Send me an email, and I will send them to you. Some are abstracts, but I have one in particular where the patient was essentially cured of a desmoid (that's what I have, along with Dupuytren's), with calcitriol. I COULD be wrong, but I just wonder if all of these collagen-related fibrotic diseases to have enough biochemistry in common for this drug to work for many.

I'll put the abstract links here, but I've worked in healthcare for 23 years, and it seems lately that there's a ton of research on vitamin D, both the "inactive" and "active" forms, mostly for cancer (breast, prostate, lung, etc.). By the way, two of these papers are free for download. And it does not mean that someone has to be "deficient" in vitamin D in order for calcitriol to work. It actually seems to have a collagen-degradation activity.

Links:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15371466&query_hl=1

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15607567&query_hl=3

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=10926872&query_hl=7

Hope this helps.

Frank

[Old Forum]

Hawk, Administrator        Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2005     2:25 am     
 
Ok here is an interesting link. Interesting because it makes more sense than I first assumed it would. Interesting because this theory was made by a person with no medical background. Interesting because of the commitment and effort this man dedicated to this effort. Interesting because I know of other doctors making a sugar, insulin / collagen connection.

I have emailed with Kevin and find this theory intriguing.

Check out

www.dupuytrens-a-new-theory.com

The following is the a discussion on the theory of dupytren's, Peyronies. and other fibrotic disorders that is a result of Kevin's research found.

This is clearly an unconventional theory.  While sounding very logical to lay persons, it has far to go before being tried, tested, and accepted by the medical community.  At the very least it is interesting, at the most it could be a set of clues that like many other cures came from an unexpected source.

Read and comment with both interest and caution.

Surgery for Peyronie's disease-sex, implant, scars, stem cell treatment

Started by Charl Surgery for Peyronie's Disease

radiation treatment for peyronie's disease ??

Started by Kojak Ultrasound and Extracorporeal Shockwave Therapy (ESWT)

ACE Inhibitors in Peyronie's Treatment?

Started by John B Oral Treatments for Peyronie's Disease