ED - Erectile Dysfunction (Started August 2005)

[atlantis]

Hi,

my 3rd continued post.  I am still researching the web to get a diagnosis.

I have read some posts in the forum about the possibility of damage of the suspensory ligament of penis by bending backward, that would fit with an 'rare penile fracture', i.e.: no pain, no hematoma...

Also, when wearing adjusted underwear I feel some mild pain in the base of penis.  

Have anybody read this?, maybe there is hope after all:

http://www.urotoday.com/53/browse_categories/urologic_trauma_and_reconstruction/the_penile_suspensory_ligament_abnormalities_and_repair.html

[newguy]

altantis - I'm a bit disappointed that the two hospitals you visited appeared to be somewhat dismissive and offered very little guidance. Maybe you'd benefit at this early stage, from seeing a recognised urologist?

[atlantis]

Hi newguy,

I have already seen a private urologist, he told me that he thought there was no penile fracture, only noticed peyronie lumps, although he could not discard fracture completely.

In any case, he recognized from my erect penis photos that the head of my penis was not filled with blood, there was something strange with blood flow.

What I'm worried is that the same morning of the movement bending down my penis, I noticed something strange in it, there was a swelling below the glans in the erect penis (I think because of deviated blood flow, I continue having it now). I think Peyronie takes more time to develop (in my case I think it was two days, because two days later I noticed the lateral deviation), and that is what makes me worry and think I had some kind of fracture.

[newguy]

atlantis - Many people with peyronies notice a sudden deviation, but in some of those cases it's likely that an inflammatory response has been occuring previous to this, whether or not pain was present. It certainly sounds as if you've experienced an injury which has almost immediately (well, in a matter of days) resulted in a deviation and blood flow issue. In your shoes, I would still attempt to seek the attention of a known urologist, as it sounds to me that your entire diagnosis was done via sight alone. Dr Levine offers telephone consultations, so I would suggest that is a valid and proactive step to take at this stage.

As your current curve is not related to scar tissue, I suppose there is a chance that your situation could improve as it's still early days really. You must have inflammation though, so I'd take ibuprofin for a couple of weeks, along with l-arginine, pentox... and possibly viagra to achieve better erections. I wouldn't advise traction or VED right now even though you have a curve, due to the fact that this is recent and it might be better to let things settle down a little before going down that route.

I'm sure others will chime in with their take on your situation.
   

[atlantis]

Hi,

just got back from the another urologist.  He explained to me the possible cause of the inflamation I have at the left side, because my prepuce is always covering my glans, possibly the urine stored under my prepuce have started the inflamation.  A similar case (in French, sorry I was not able to find something similar in English):

http://images.google.fr/imgres?imgurl=http://img262.echo.cx/img262/1818/img17mb.jpg&imgrefurl=http://forum.doctissimo.fr/doctissimo/erection/penis-gonfle-droit-sujet_149204_1.htm&usg=__VSiXNHkXg80pyMqCYTJj2nRDqUE=&h=640&w=480&sz=21&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=wmKs75TQYzGYbM:&tbnh=137&tbnw=103&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dgonflement%2Bpenis%2Berection%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DG%26um%3D1

The photograph (in my case the inflamation is even bigger):

http://img262.echo.cx/img262/1818/img17mb.jpg

That fits, because I have seen photos of peyronies afected penises with dramatic curvatures, but none with a big swelling area.

The doctor gave me Piascledine 300, which I read is another vitamien E suplement, and told me that what I have is just inflamation. He told me not to have sexual activity, no masturbation for one month (the other doctors told me I could masturbate without excess).

Still I can feel a lump (and the other doctor who diagnosed peyronie saw it), so I do not know what to think, or if peyronie and the inflamation caused by urine under the prepuce are related.  In any case, when that inflamation be down, things will be much better.

I will continue going to other doctors, to see what they say.

[newguy]

You're being very proactive with this issue, so that's certainly positive. Let's hope that your condition turns out to be something that is readily treatable and that the treatment given to you works . Keep us in the loop.

[cowboyfood]

Hey all, I'm new to posting, but I've read many of the posts and I appreciate the time spent by everyone to share their information.

I'm 47 and last December (2008) I noticed a "dent" at the top, right side, about a half-inch below the head: This causes the end of my penis to curve upward slightly.

I have had no other noticeable physical effects since then.

However, I recently became paranoid about ED. Once I started reading the posts about ED a couple of days ago, it scared me, and yesterday I was not able to even obtain an erection while trying to stimulate myself (I'm currently single).  

I was really stressed throughout the whole time and I'm thinking the main reason why I couldn't get an erection last night is b/c of the stress.

any comments are appreciated!

[nemo]

You just taught yourself an object lesson in "mind over matter" I'm afraid.  Yes, being stressed about it will impair your erection, even when you're alone.  It sounds like you have a pretty normal, relatively mild, manageable case of Peyronie's.  That close to the glans, it shouldn't really cause a major ED problem, at least no more than a little softness at the head, which is what I deal with.  Don't let your mind create an ED problem where there really is none.

Best advice, relax ... treat the Peyronies Disease conservatively, handle with care, and don't talk yourself into ED.

Good luck,
Nemo

[cowboyfood]

Nemo,

Thank you for your opinion.  I have an appt w/ a urologist next week.

(by the way, if anyone knows of an Atlanta Urologist they would recommend, I'd like to hear about it - I have an appt via http://www.atlantaurological.com/services.shtml with Dr. Schoborg)

Again, thanks to Nemo and everyone else.  Because of this forum, I have been "treating" myself by taking Isomer E (Gen Nut), L-Arinine, and Saw Palmetto.  

I have never experienced pain, in either erect or flaccid state.  But, it seems like when my mind is focused on my penis and the "dent" I can feel discomfort, or not.  But, when I don't think about it, I don't feel anything.  

-cowboyfood

[bluth]

Is there any sort of pattern for how long it takes for ED to kick in? Or what kind of plaques cause ED, i.e. where it is placed?

I have a fairly large plaque in the middle of my penis and also on the top that is causing a dent and upward curvature, as well as a newer plaque lower down on my penis (not sure the placement), and am wondering what the chances are I might suffer from ED.

[didi20031]

bluth

I don't think that there is a pattern, especially since the psychological part is very important for the correct function of a mans penis.

I suffered from ED in the very beginning of the disease (after about 1 month) but now (after 9 months) my erections are firm again. the only problem is my glans, which does not fill with blood like before (it seems as if the blood can flow in normally, but flows out of the glans too easily...) This may be connected to the location of my plaques very close to the top of my penis.

didi

[Hawk]

There are men on the forum that have severe deformity and have had Peyronies Disease for over 10 years with NO impact on their erections, so didi is correct.  There is no rule.

[bluth]

Is there any sort of idea how many people end up suffering from ED significant enough so that they can no longer get hard even without assitance from viagra, rings, etc?

It seems like this is a fairly small group, but I'm not sure and haven't seen any kind of statistics on this.

[bluth]

There are men on the forum that have severe deformity and have had Peyronies Disease for over 10 years with NO impact on their erections, so didi is correct.  There is no rule.

Are you aware of people having Peyronies Disease for over ten years with no impact on their erections, and then having an impact?

It seems like you are saying that ED is no forgone conclusion after contracting Peyronies Disease (which I'd certainly hope), but I am more interested if ED often comes at a much later stage of the disease, an early stage, or if there is no rule whatsoever.

This may be what you are implying, but I'd just like to make sure I am interpreting you correctly. Thanks.

[LWillisjr]

Are you aware of people having Peyronies Disease for over ten years with no impact on their erections, and then having an impact?

It seems like you are saying that ED is no forgone conclusion after contracting Peyronies Disease (which I'd certainly hope), but I am more interested if ED often comes at a much later stage of the disease, an early stage, or if there is no rule whatsoever.

This may be what you are implying, but I'd just like to make sure I am interpreting you correctly. Thanks.

bluth,

It sounds like you are assuming ED follows Peyronies disease, when in fact in can be the other way around. One thought of causality is that ED starts to occur first, and then from being in a "not as firm as I used to be" state makes one more susceptible to bending or trauma that can trigger the Peyronies mechanism. I know I didn't answer your other question, but I don't have my 10 year veteran star yet.

[Hawk]

[Are you aware of people having Peyronies Disease for over ten years with no impact on their erections, and then having an impact?

No I am not aware of any that developed ED 10 years into the disease but I am sure there are some.  Lots of the general population get ED.  There is nothing to PREVENT that from happening to a man with Peyronies Disease as he ages etc.

[nemo]

Bluth, it sounds like you're panicking at the thought that ED follows Peyronies Disease, thus you're starting to feel doomed to get ED.  That's a dangerous train of thought and I suggest you embrace the fact that there's simply no way to know or predict what Peyronies Disease will do to you.  Could you develop ED?  Yes.  Will you?  Maybe yes, maybe no.  Realistically, there are numerous conditions that increase likelihood of ED - high blood pressure, diabetes, heart problems, etc., etc.  Peyronies Disease doesn't doom you to ED, so stop panicking about that or else you'll worry yourself into ED problems that are purely self-induced.  

Concentrate on treating your Peyronies Disease with therapies discussed here, continue to use your penis prudently and enjoy it.  If (and that's a big IF) you develop ED down the road, there are numerous treatments that are very effective for managing it and continuing to have a great sex life.  Cross that bridge when (and if) you come to it. Don't force the issue.

Take care,
Nemo

[bluth]

Thank you for the comments everyone. A very useful board as always. Best wishes to all  .

[cowboyfood]

update,

first, thanks to the board's vets for their words of encouragement.  

last week, I was "very concerned" about not being able to get an erection, and I was physically working myself over to try to obtain one with no success.

"very concerned" means I was in a total state of panic/depression/anxiety, you name it!  My inability to get an erection happened "overnight" and I now understand that the ED situation was most likely a result of my psychological state...major anxiety.

anyway, b/c of the pm's to me, I started to get more rationale.  I decided to just forget about trying to stimulate myself, and give it a rest; putting as little pressure on me as possible to get erect.  Also, I went ahead and started taking 1/2 a pill of cialis every other day just to be "doing something.

well, the combination of my mind being much more normal combined with the cialis effect (I guess), I've had several nocturnal erections (believe me, I jumped out of bed, turned on the lights, etc.) that ranged between 6 and 8 on the scale I've seen posted.

...also, I noticed last night while I was walking home from law school (I'm 46 --- career change!!!, I'm not 26),
and only thinking about my upcoming con law final, I had an erection -- wow!.

so, b/c of the erections, I've been able to visibly evaluate my condition...and it looks about the same; dent on the top/right side, about an inch below the glans...so, it's about the same -- which I'm claiming a success...

it's been about the same since the end of december...my dent;  maybe it's gotten a little more pronounced, but basically the same...

I'm seeing a 2nd uro on 5/11, one referred by my first uro b/c this guy is "into peyronie's.", I'll try to get the Pentox...another board member has seen this uro and got an Rx for pentox...

now, I'm taking
Vit E 400mg, down from 800 (GNC Isomer) I reduced just for the heck of it...
L-Arginine about 2g
Saw Palmetto

I've been meaning to pick up ALC --- just from what I've read.

per the supplements, personally I don't understand them, but I'm taking the advice from the board.

CB

[UK]

Cowboyfood, isn't one of the side effects of saw palmetto - ED? What you taking that for specifically - Peyronie's or something else?

[cowboyfood]

UK...

I have no idea! but, I'll look into it...

I'm taking it b/c a friend suggested it to me (before my Peyronies Disease condition)...I've never looked into the possible ED effects.

If so, I'm more than happy to stop taking it.

CB

[cowboyfood]

I'm busy with school, but, a quick "google" on saw palmetto actually came up with one article (supposedly authored by an M.D.) that suggests SP is used to "eliminate" ED...

http://www.nature-ally.com/erectile-dysfunction.html

I'll look into more later.

CB

[Mick]

I'm taking saw palmetto for an enlarged prostate.  It takes a while to take effect but I've gone from 5 to 7 toilet trips in the nite to 1 or 2.

[Pete28]

Does anybody know what's the exact 'scientific' explaination that, while having a large curve in your penis, this affects the hardness and maintainance of the erection? I have significant bend but there is no pain whatsoever when erect.
Apparently there is a direct correlation. Because i have read some with some guys who have been able to straigthen the curve, the erectile riability also came back.

[Hawk]

I have never heard a doctor give a thorough explanation of the mechanics of Peyronies Disease related ED.  

Erections result from nerve centers transmitting the message for the release of nitric oxide (NO) in the walls of the penis arteries.  These arteries lie deep in the penis.  The NO causes the arteries to relax, dilate, expand.  This dilation allows and increased volume on blood flowing into the penis.  The rate is faster than the rate at which the veins allow the blood to flow out causing the penis to fill and expand.  Incidentally, the veins lie close to the surface of the penis.  This is kind of a chain reaction since an erect penis tends to squeeze and constrict the veins and this slows the volume of blood the veins can remove from the penis even more.

It is mostly my speculation but I think that Peyronies Disease causes ED in 2 ways.  One is stress of the disease that cause adrenalin to attach to the NO receptors and prevent the NO from dilating the arteries. I guess it is also possible that Peyronies Disease could cause distraction from psychological stimulation and even prevent the release of NO.  In either of these cases, one would likely still get night-time erections (NTE).

I speculate the other cause is physical in that the location of plaque is positioned so it prevents a major vein from being squeezed or constricted.  In other words the plaque holds the constricting force off of the vein.  This allows the vein to drain blood at a faster rate.

The problem is that al this is interrelated.  As soon as a guy sees his penis is not as hard as it should be he begins to stress or experience anxiety which releases adrenalin.  The adrenalin prevents the NO from dilating the arteries and now he has a mixed case of physical and psychological issues impacting his erection.

Since the veins are closer to the surface, the problem of veins transporting too much blood out of the penis can be helped with a constriction band like the adjustable Actis Loop.

Until someone finds (or comes up with) a better explanation, this one is the only thing that makes sense to me.

These illustrations my help.  https://www.peyroniesforum.net/index.php/topic,106.0.html

[Pete28]

I speculate the other cause is physical in that the location of plaque is positioned so it prevents a major vein from being squeezed or constricted.  In other words the plaque holds the constricting force off of the vein.  This allows the vein to drain blood at a faster rate.

So theoretically, by stretching fibrotic tissue (if possible) the veins could regain there ability to prevent blood outflow and thereby a solid erection would be regained?

[LWillisjr]

I speculate the other cause is physical in that the location of plaque is positioned so it prevents a major vein from being squeezed or constricted.  In other words the plaque holds the constricting force off of the vein.  This allows the vein to drain blood at a faster rate.

So theoretically, by stretching fibrotic tissue (if possible) the veins could regain there ability to prevent blood outflow and thereby a solid erection would be regained?

Sorry to disagree.

My understanding is that both the arteries and veins involved during an ereciton are below the tunica. Yes the arteries are deeper but all are beneath the tunica. By definition Peyronies Disease is scarring on the tunica. So I'm struggling with the physcial connection between Peyronies Disease and ED. Let's not forget that many with Peyronies Disease don't have any ED problems. I don't want anyone to think that if they get Peyronies Disease, that it automatically implies ED.

[newguy]

lwillisjr - I do that that there is a often link between ED and peyronie's. I suppose it could be argued that the number of peyronie's suffering being of a certain age, but even the younger members here often suffer from ED. There's probably a psychological component to that, but I'd be surprised if that explained all of what is occuring. Peyronies Disease is scarring, yes, but there is assumption being made that no damage at all occurs elsewhere. I'm sure there are multiple elements relating to this disorder that we are not fully aware of at this time.

[LWillisjr]

lwillisjr - I do that that there is a often link between ED and peyronie's. I suppose it could be argued that the number of peyronie's suffering being of a certain age, but even the younger members here often suffer from ED. There's probably a psychological component to that, but I'd be surprised if that explained all of what is occuring. Peyronies Disease is scarring, yes, but there is assumption being made that no damage at all occurs elsewhere. I'm sure there are multiple elements relating to this disorder that we are not fully aware of at this time.

Newguy,
I think we owe it to our fellow sufferers here that we need to change our way of thinking. Instead of of thinking that there is "probably a psychological component", we need to point out that there IS a psychological component. When I first developed Peyronies I was sure I was psychologically handling it fine. It took my wife to help me understand that it was affecting me mentally and physically. As men, all of us at one time focus on the way our penis looks, feels, the size, sensation, ability to achieve orgasm on command, etc.  So when just one of these aspects changes it does impact us in some way. I was getting to where I was losing my interest in sex and didn't realize it. The frequency of sex slowly decreased and I didn't notice it. I was mentally slipping in to a new "comfort area" for me. No sex meant I didn't have to face my deformity or try to find new positions. Under regular circumstances I'm all for finding new positions, but not when it is because the current way is uncomfortable or isn't working.

I'm not saying there isn't some indirect link between Peyronies Disease and ED, but I haven't figured out the physics of penile mechanics of this yet. And my point is that we all need to realize there is a bigger psychological component at play here that we may not realize or choose to ignore.  

[Pete28]

It may depend on which site of the tunica and/or cavernosal bodies fibrotic changes occur and how 'big' the plaque is.
It's is well know that fibrotic changes in the penis can leave a pattern that is consistent with veno-occlusive dysfunction.
It occurs quite often, but not allways. The aswer to that i don't know. But it's the same question as why some people survive cancers and others not, why some people can run marathons below 3 hours and others not. I believe gene factors play a key role. Within a hundred years from now, i'm sure science will be able to explain a lot more.

[/quote]

Sorry to disagree.

My understanding is that both the arteries and veins involved during an ereciton are below the tunica. Yes the arteries are deeper but all are beneath the tunica. By definition Peyronies Disease is scarring on the tunica. So I'm struggling with the physcial connection between Peyronies Disease and ED. Let's not forget that many with Peyronies Disease don't have any ED problems. I don't want anyone to think that if they get Peyronies Disease, that it automatically implies ED.
[/quote]

[bluth]

Should I refuse an injection if my urologist wants to give me one to induce an erection and measure the degree of curvature in my penis?

I've read that people have advised against getting injections before and wanted to see people's thoughts before I visit my urologist today.

I have no trouble getting erections otherwise without any sort of ring or pills.

Thanks

[voulezvous]

Bluth:

Its difficult to make a case for injections because there is ALWAYS a risk. Many on this forum swear they will never allow another because of damage they had done whether by chance or just poor work by a urologist. Personally, I have been getting verapamil injections on a 8-week basis for about 2 years & have never had a problem-even with bruising. Its no picnic but, assuming you have a competent urologist, I would not refuse the injection if he/she thinks it is in order. I believe the odds are in your favor-especially if it is just once.

[jackp]

bluth

The injections I advise against are PGE1 and/or trimix for ED. These injections over time can cause corporal fibrosis. I tried them for about a year and made my corporal fibrosis worse.

An injection in the doctors office by a doctor should not cause any problems.

Jackp

[Pete28]

How do you mean? There are a lot of 1 shot = permanent damage cases?

Then why is it performed in hospital if the risk it that high?

Bluth:

Its difficult to make a case for injections because there is ALWAYS a risk. Many on this forum swear they will never allow another because of damage they had done whether by chance or just poor work by a urologist. Personally, I have been getting verapamil injections on a 8-week basis for about 2 years & have never had a problem-even with bruising. Its no picnic but, assuming you have a competent urologist, I would not refuse the injection if he/she thinks it is in order. I believe the odds are in your favor-especially if it is just once.

[newguy]

I'm not saying there isn't some indirect link between Peyronies Disease and ED, but I haven't figured out the physics of penile mechanics of this yet. And my point is that we all need to realize there is a bigger psychological component at play here that we may not realize or choose to ignore.  

I think it's risky to go all of nothing with any statement, so that's why I included the "probably" comment really. I do agree though that I can see how dealing with peyronie's can impact our attitude towards sex, our image of ourselves and so on. Since peyronies tends to manifest itself once an erection is achieved, I can certainly see how on a conscious or unconscious level, there can be an element of fear attached to achieving an erection, because we never quite know what we're going to be presented with. It is a heavy load to carry. I myself thought that I can coping very well, but a few days back I had something I'd only be able to describe as a slight panic attack -something I've never before experienced. Very strange. It's no doubt often hard to gauge our own experience until we find ourselves in a different state of mind.

Again though, I do think that ED is sometimes linked to both the mental side or things, and peyronie's disease itself. I should think there is quite a spread of people with ED for one reason, the other, or both.

[voulezvous]

Maybe I was too extreme in my warning. I only meant to suggest that there are people on this forum who have had bad expeiences with injections. Not that it is "high risk." There's some risk involved in any procedure. At some point you either have to roll the dice a little & trust or you may not find any answers. Ultimately, its your decision.

How do you mean? There are a lot of 1 shot = permanent damage cases?

Then why is it performed in hospital if the risk it that high?

Bluth:

Its difficult to make a case for injections because there is ALWAYS a risk. Many on this forum swear they will never allow another because of damage they had done whether by chance or just poor work by a urologist. Personally, I have been getting verapamil injections on a 8-week basis for about 2 years & have never had a problem-even with bruising. Its no picnic but, assuming you have a competent urologist, I would not refuse the injection if he/she thinks it is in order. I believe the odds are in your favor-especially if it is just once.

[RichB]

I know that in my dealing with this condition my view of sex has changed immensely. It honestly doesn't seem as fun and care-free as it did before. I know that will change in time, but right now my views of sex have definitely changed in a big way.

[voulezvous]

I know that in my dealing with this condition my view of sex has changed immensely. It honestly doesn't seem as fun and care-free as it did before. I know that will change in time, but right now my views of sex have definitely changed in a big way.

richB

I suppose because of my age I am a rare situation but I want to respond to your post. I spent the 1st 60 years of my life with the "fun & care-free" feeling you mention as well. More to the point, without being aware of it, I was always confident to a fault & it affected my disregard for women's feelings. I used sex as a tool to build my ego. Then came the crash. I have been humbled & I will never take any level of sex for granted again. Truthfully, Peyronies Disease helped to make a better man of me because I learned 2 very big lessons: I am much more than my sexual ability and women (God bless 'em) are no where nearly as concerned about what is between your legs as I used to think. No, you will probably never be quite the same, physically or mentally, but, if you dig deep, you will find that life is still very, very good & you can find ways to use this trial to grow as a man.

[Bongo]

Hawk,

Your explanation to erectile difficulty in Peyronies makes so much sense in my case. I am now waiting to start VED theraphy. Hopefully, I can manipulate some of the scarring positively in the course of time, which will allow my veins to contrict naturally. I do not have a clue where the scares are located, so I can only speculate.

Thanks - no doctor of mine has ever talked about any possible explanation to my ED. They simply tell me to use Viagra - "all your problems will be solved young man".

I have found absteining from masturbation, heat treatment and drinking alcohol to help with the ED and reduce the pain ("somewhat normalised erectile function", although as of yet with no spontanious erections). But as soon as I masturbate, I am more or less back to square one with ED and pain.

My penis is also not very sensitive anymore after 5 years with this disease. The day where I will have a spontanious, unpainful erection again will definitely mark a breakthrough for me.

[ocelot556]

I'm the same way, Bongo, but my reward will not have to expect every time I can't get hard for any reason whatsoever that this is the first time for the rest of my life that I've got full ED. It's that doubt that's the worst damn part of ED. Before I had peyronie's if I didn't get hard, oh well, there's always tomorrow. I'll get some sleep, or eat something, or try again in an hour. I have a dullness of sensation because of the pain I had for so long, too, or maybe because the scars are depressing nerves - I don't know, though the pain isn't almost ever there anymore.

Also, for those of you who experience ED from this - sometimes it feels as if I can feel the blood draining out of the side of my penis that is more scarred - of course it always causes me to panic and lose my erection, so I can't tell if I'd lose the damn thing anyway. Is this a common feeling? Or maybe me overthinking an uncomfortable feeling?  

[RichB]

How much does Cialis cost on average per month?

[cowboyfood]

richb,

I just filled a prescription at CVS for three 20mg tablets for $58.

I've been cutting them in half and taking one of the halves every other day.  

However, the uro I saw yesterday suggested I try Viagra; he wrote me a prescription for 100mg pills and he wants me to cut them into 4 pieces; then take one of the pieces on a daily basis.  But, I'm not sure of the cost.

Also, I believe Tim suggested using Horny Goat Weed in place of Viagra because it has the same "ingredient" that makes Viagra effective (search for his post, I don't have it handy); and, I believe the HGW route is substantially less expensive than Viagra.

I've never used Cialis (or anything similar) until a couple of weeks ago.  It worked and help get me through a psychological rough spot I was going through.

CF

[LWillisjr]

cowboyfood,

Cialis works over a longer period of time. Not sure why the uro recomended the Cialis over Viagra. With Viagra you have to do a little more "planning" for sex. I've had Cialis and Viagra. Both have the same positive effect for me, but the Cialis does seem to last longer. The viagra is not easy to break into 4 pieces.

[Tim468]

I dropped the HGW for routine use of Cialis. IT does a better job of making me eternally ready, but slightly more side effects of nasal congestion. I take only about 5 mg every other day - a low dose.

Tim

[cowboyfood]

cowboyfood,

Cialis works over a longer period of time. Not sure why the uro recomended the Cialis over Viagra. With Viagra you have to do a little more "planning" for sex. I've had Cialis and Viagra. Both have the same positive effect for me, but the Cialis does seem to last longer. The viagra is not easy to break into 4 pieces.

lwillisjr,

Actually, the uro (the second one) suggested the Viagra over the Cialis.  I can't remember why (my bad).  The first uro I saw gave me a prescription for viagra, cialis, and levitra, and did not elaborate on which to use.  So, I just took a "stab" at cialis.  

But, I think I'll try the Viagra...and, yes I've read on here that it is a challenge to cut the 100mg into 4 pieces.  But, someone suggested that had some success with a pill cutter they bought.

CF

[Jackieo]

Cowboy and all:
My two-cents...I have experimented with both Cialis and Viagra over the past few years (following a difficult surgery).  The two different pills are both easily cut into halves or quarters with a cheap over-the-counter pill cutter (the shape of Cialis makes it hard to judge cutting equal portions when you are trying for four equal quarters).  Viagra caused me to flush (...I thought I was experiencing male menopause), congestion, and made my heart to race.  The Cialis is a dependable ready-when-U-R solution without those side effects (for me)....I read a post by Tim468 that he had nasal congestion from the Cialis.
Like all these drugs... I think you need to find a good level for yourself and keep to a uniform schedule.  I was originally using Cialis for "sex" and it caused me rushes....not the case now that I am using the minimum daily dose.  Start with a smaller dosage and build-up.
JackieO

[Hawk]

Am I the only guy around that gets the listed side effect of delayed back pain?

I have used all 3 but due to the back backpain from Cialis, and the need to avoid food with Viagra, I opt for Levitra.

[RichB]

I think I may be beginning to develop venous leak. This is very disheartening. It seemed to come out of nowhere.

[LWillisjr]

Am I the only guy around that gets the listed side effect of delayed back pain?

I have used all 3 but due to the back backpain from Cialis, and the need to avoid food with Viagra, I opt for Levitra.

Hawk,
I've tried both Viagra and Cialis. No side effects with either one.  sorry  

[LWillisjr]

I think I may be beginning to develop venous leak. This is very disheartening. It seemed to come out of nowhere.

Richb,
What are the symptoms you are experiencing that leads you to think venous leakage? I'm just curious as I have no idea what the symptoms are.