CIALIS, VIAGRA, LEVITRA, STENDRA Effects, Questions, Availability, Prices

[blackseal]

Here you go:  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21324095

[skunkworks]

@dannyocean - I bought generic cialis - Tadalafil - and split the tablets.  Am taking 3mg - 4mg daily.  Works great from an erection perspective, also can tell while flaccid that the bloodflow is much increased.  You can get generic cialis for about $2.00 a tablet....

Where did you get it? The stuff i got from alldaychem was not very effective.

[restore]

I think this is exciting.  I've sent a letter to my Dr asking if he would prescribe me Cialis as another part of my treatment regimen (currently Pentox, ALC, L-Arginine, Ubiquinol).  Only thing that concerns me in this study, was that the scar tissues were not palpable among these men, but only seen with ultrasound.  And the Cialis group included young men, (although the average age between the two groups were about the same).  But, still the findings represent good news I think for us.

[George999]

I agree.  This IS pretty cool and an aspect of Cialis that none of us really understood before.  My assumption was that it was improved erection quality provided by Cialis that caused improvement.  But this research seems to be indicating a direct benefit from Cialis itself.  That is indeed cool stuff.  - George

[fubar]

Blackseal

Thanks for leaving that link i needed the boost.Another reason to stay with cialis! I was told that it can help scar tissue bit to read about has a better impact.

Fubar

[Worried Guy]

I would like to try this but I doubt the NHS will pay!  The NHS seems good for so many things but not peyronies!  I wish i had private healthcare.

[fubar]

Worried Guy

Try telling them you need it for erectile dysfunction. ED is more recognized as a problem anyway.

Fubar

[blackseal]

Hi Skunkworks.  I got mine here:  tabsmarket.com/cialis.html

Works very well for me.  

Good luck!

[crashbandit]

Trazodone is really cheap and can be taken on a daily basis. I notice my nighttime erections are amazing and regular sex drive and erection strength during arousal is much better aswell.

I take 25mg, 1 hour before bed with food. I swear it has helped the healing and a nice flacid hang during the day.

[George999]

I think the wildcard here for Peyronie's is that there is now a new study out claiming/showing that Cialis can actually heal Peyronie's scar tissue.  That is pretty impressive.  Your not only looking at improved erections, but also ACTUALLY HEALING OF DAMAGED TISSUES.  I don't *need* a PDE5 drug for ED, but for sure at this point, I am going to talk to my uro about cialis for Peyronie's.  - George

[chefcasey]

It looks like a decent study, even though the sample size isn't nearly as large as the pentox or coq10 studies, and they were much more extensive in terms of Peyronies Disease specifically.  I'm just a little skeptical.  There are so many guys on this forum taking cialis, yet I haven't heard of anybody who said it's helped their Peyronies Disease, only ED. Then again, The same guys are usually on a combination of drugs so it's tough to isolate variables.  I'd try it if a uro would prescribe a low dose, although with pentox and L-arginine, my erectile quality is already through the roof(which is nothing to complain about  ), I'd be scared of any possible priapism though with everything else.

[skunkworks]

You might have a better shot if you say the Cialis is for fertility.

[newguy]

I guess at the very least it's another tick in the box, confirming that current treatment strategies are pretty much on target. Those men coming here, newly diagnosed, and being pushed in the direction of the PAV cocktail type treatments, or maybe more updated regimens which include CoQ10 and a 24hour+ PDE5 inhibitor (cialis) instead of a partial day one, are on the right track in my view.

One reason I switched from Viagra to Cialis is that I considered that its positive effects might extend beyond that of simply gaining a stronger erection. As such, it would make such to have it in your system 24/7. Of course it may well be the case that the stronger erections are what causes these improvements, the jury is out on that one I guess. As the study didn't even relate to deformity, maybe it's of limited use to us. Still, if the core finding relating to scarring is true, then it's definitely good to know.

Men in the study presented at an average of 22 months, and yet according to the study results this wasn't an excessive time period. With the previous pentox study, the time period was a year +. There seems to be this overriding idea among urologists that a point is reached quite early on, where oral reatments become useless. I think over time, that stance is looking to be on shaky ground. I would agree that 'logically' scar tissue is scar tissue, and as such you should not expect it is change much over time. However, in so many ways peyronie's scarring doesn't always appear to behave like scarring as you would typically recognise it. Well, maybe that's an overstatement, sometimes it does, but maybe in some cases, the tissue seems to be more 'in limbo', and can maybe be nudged in one direction causing improvements years after onset, if the right treatment approach is taken.

[George999]

I think the good news here IS that these men had no real deformity.  This would mean that there was no serious amount of stretching going on.  And if Cialis wasn't causing additional stretching, there has to be some other mode of operation whereby it was bringing about the healing of the scar tissue.  And that is not only good news.  It is very good news because it shows that Cialis is therapeutic aside from its erection producing capabilities.

I think perhaps the percieved failure of the Viagra component of the PAV cocktail was due to Viagra being aimed more toward erection strength (ie ED issues) than toward pure non-erection related Peyronie's issues like resolving scar tissue.  And that was directly related to practitioners simply being unaware that PDE5 inhibitors are more than just a one trick pony.

The whole idea that after a certain amount of time everything is hopeless when it comes to Peyronie's is simply infuriating to me.   When you go to the doc with Peyronie's, what does he usually tell you?  Of course, just calm down and wait and see what happens because this thing usually just clears up on its own.  And he sends you home with instructions to relax and take some vitamin E.  Then you come back after a bit and it hasn't cleared up and then what does he tell you?  Well then he tells you its now too late to do anything about it and he offers to refer you to a good surgeon.  Whats wrong with this picture?  Is this good medicine or what?   I would assert that from the beginning to the end these doctors don't understand Peyronie's and quite frankly don't know what they are talking about and they are dooming their patients to wrong choices and protracted psychological and physical pain.  And that is why I for one am absolutely rabid about encouraging Peyronie's patients to go to a Peyronie's specialist IMMEDIATELY and not fool around with these ignorant small time docs who may be outstanding doctors when it comes to treating everyday health issues, but when it comes to arcane things like Peyronie's, they are more lost than the patient.

[skunkworks]

Cialis is so freaking expensive though. To run that 6 month treatment would cost quite a bit with the namebrand stuff, and I'd have to find a liquid that cialis is soluble in to cut the dose to 2.5mg as apparently it is insoluble in water...

My gf is a doctor though so getting it prescribed is no difficulty.

Can someone explain the healing part though? I am not 100% sure what "resolution of septal scar" means.

[UK]

my interpretation of the study is this - the scar was not palpable and did not cause deformity as it was "septal" so less on the surface and more deep in the area seperating the chambers of the corpora. Therefore ED symptoms but no typical Peyronies symptoms of curvature. Still a scar is a scar, so this interesting.

[newguy]

Perhaps, if the study is correct, it's easier for Cialis to eliminate or reduce scarring in some areas of the penis compared to others. I think if Cialis alone was capable of causing very dramatic differences in actual deformity, we'd have heard about it. Of course though, there are disease stage related issues,  and issues relating to degrees of improvement and time taking the treatment etc. I think there is possibly a bigger window in the early days for really hitting this disease from all angles (pentox, l-arginine, pycnogenol, cialis, coq10, ALC, mechanical treatments etc). And of course as stated earlier in this thread there it might be a mistake for those with long term peyronie's to simply assume that there is no spoke for improvement with these treatments too. If more men stick with potentially effective treatments for a decent span of time (1 year+), I think they'll often time themselves in a better place.

We've spoken before about how in some ways, we don't view anything other than a total resolution of pyronie's disease as an improvement. Any reduction in worsening or curvature is a good thing though, and puts you in a better position even if you do eventually go on to more invasive treatmnents like xiaflex or surgery. There's also a preventative aspect to a good treatment plan. I'm of the believe that if further injury or inflammation occurs, these might well often be nipped in the bud if you're already on an effective treatment regimen.  

[skunkworks]

Perhaps, if the study is correct, it's easier for Cialis to eliminate or reduce scarring in some areas of the penis compared to others. I think if Cialis alone was capable of causing very dramatic differences in actual deformity, we'd have heard about it.

Not many would take a daily dose of cialis for 6 months. Though its use is widespread, chronic use is not.

[chefcasey]

Yea...This study wasn't particular to Peyronies Disease.  "Isolated septal scarring" is much less serious, such as a one time  injury to the septum, rather than a continuous inflammatory process such as Peyronies Disease.  Septal scarring and tunical scarring should be the same thing, the only difference is the septum is the part of the tunica that wraps the chambers in between rather than around, but the same tissue none the less.  So if it was successfull in resolution of those scars, I see no reason why  it wouldn't resolve in the tunica.  

Why did they choose isolated septal scars instead of or not in addition to isolated tunical scars?  Who knows.  I do know that septal scars are much more painful than tunica scars(probably because it's a tighter space, more nerves, etc.), as I have both of them confirmed by ultrasound.  It's impossible to see any deformity from septal scars because they are in the middle of the two erectile bodies.  So maybe this was a study based purely on men having pain from septal scars.  

Anyways it's still interesting, so I will ask Dr. Levine about it as well as a lot of other questions on my mind when I see him in 3 weeks.

[newguy]

Not many would take a daily dose of cialis for 6 months. Though its use is widespread, chronic use is not.

Fair point, but I don't think it's entirely unheard of. It might be that those on such treatment have had improvements that they didn't put down to this. Unless something has a very dramatic effect, it's often difficult to know what to put the improvement down to. At least now that we're aware of this study, we can better keep track of what improvements people have, and plot them against the treatments they're on.

Yea...This study wasn't particular to Peyronies Disease.  "Isolated septal scarring" is much less serious, such as a one time  injury to the septum, rather than a continuous inflammatory process such as Peyronies Disease.  

Yes, maybe that is a factor here. Still, if it can help a one time injury, it may be contribute to helping or dampening  down peyronie's processes. At least with it working 24/7, it may add to the effectiveness of other treatments to make a more potent approach to peyronie's disease treatment.

[MikeSmith0]

If i take cialis, I have really intense nighttime erections - and i wake up with them too... I am getting worried that i might actually be erect all night ... is that even possible?  I don't want to make things worse & priaprism leads to MORE scarring so that's the last thing I need.

Nothing hurts though... and it basically goes away right after I go to the bathroom (but not when I just  stand up and get out of bed which I think is what normally happens?  It's been 5-6 years since I had natural morning erections i can't remember).   I never have nighttime erections like i do when i take cialis  (and cialis as needed is allowed on the xiaflex trial btw)...and it's a really long acting drug.

On the flip side, maybe there is benefit to having nighttime erections again (assuming they come and go and it's not erect the whole night) in that it allows in oxygen, etc... again.    

[newguy]

I would think that's it's possible. I can see why you'd be concerned, if you're waking up with strong erections. Waking erections are of course perfectly normal though. I personally don't think that there's reason to believe that you have personally experienced it. If pain was present I'd be much more concerned.

[restore]

Just added a new post to the Cialis discussion page on Wikipedia.  Hopefully more doctors will read this and be open to prescribing it as another weapon in our arsenal of treatments.

[skunkworks]

Anyone know what cialis is soluble in? Not water.

[restore]

Yay!  My doctor prescribed me the low dose daily Cialis.  I like that he is open to trying many options.  His reasoning is it certainly can't hurt to try.  The first urologist I went to hadn't even heard of using pentox, Ubiquinol, ALC, or other oral treatments.  And he graduated from the Mayo Clinic!  Why arent urologists staying abreast of these newer treatments that do have objective evidence from studies that they help?  

[crashbandit]

Yay!  My doctor prescribed me the low dose daily Cialis.  I like that he is open to trying many options.  His reasoning is it certainly can't hurt to try.  The first urologist I went to hadn't even heard of using pentox, Ubiquinol, ALC, or other oral treatments.  And he graduated from the Mayo Clinic!  Why arent urologists staying abreast of these newer treatments that do have objective evidence from studies that they help?  

Because they want to keep us sicker and make more money off us. You don't make any money if you just cure the person. I'm totally just joking, lol.

How many mg is a low dose of Cialis? How much are you paying for it?

[restore]

It's 2.5 mg, and 30 tablets.  Picked it up yesterday at my local CVS pharmacy, cost was $136.00.  
That's my portion after my Blue Cross pays whatever it pays.
I asked, and pharmacist said there is no generic version.  

[fubar]

Restore

I have blue cross also and they don't pay much. I believe my first purchase of 10 pills at 2o mg cost me 197.00 .There is no generic in the states this is why I by mine from rivrfarmacy generic yes differences in how they work none. I would much rather pay 3 dollars on a pill than 24.00.

Fubar

[crashbandit]

I'm thinking about taking low-dose Cialis for it's healing properties. I don't have a problem with ED so that's why I will be taking the low-dose form. But I'm wondering what a low-dose Cialis is?

Does Cialis up ones labido? Has anyone notice if the drug wore off after awhile? Because I was taking Trazodone (25mg) before for nighttime erections and I noticed the drug wore off after awhile, usually in about a month time.

I'm going to see the doctor tomorrow about Cialis. I'm going to lie and say I have ED problems because I'm afraid if I tell him the truth that he won't prescribe it to me. I don't think he will prescribe me low-dose Cialis because it has anti-fibrotic healing properties.

What dose should I ask him for? I don't want to high of a dose because of priapism risks.

Thanks

[restore]

Crashbandit, this may work for you too, I printed out the summary of the Cialis study results and showed it to my uro, and he agreed to prescribe it for me.  Its the same low dose in the study, 2.5 mg daily.  My uro feels it's worth trying especially given the recent research that supports it.  He felt there is no harm done to try, maybe yours will feel same way.  Think it's good to stay honest with the doc you're working with in fighting this condition.  If he says no, you may want to work with someone else.

[crashbandit]

Thanks restore, I''l ask him for that dosage then, 2.5 mg. And I'll take it just before bedtime every night. I hope the Cialis gives a nice healthy hang during the day, and avoid the hard, shrunken flaccid state that I've had recently.

How has your experience with Cialis been so far restore?

[restore]

I've just started it, but have noticed a weightier longer flaccid state during the day, feels good.  And it gets hard quickly when thinking of sex or when my wife and I start to engage in foreplay.  The study was 6 months long, so I'm really curious if I'll get some scar reduction in the longterm.

[Luciano]

Hmm just wondering..
All studies I have seen speak of 5mg doses..
I wonder if 2.5mg have the same effect.. Actually low dose cialis can be bought in what they call "monthly supply" that is 30 doses at 5mg

It would be interesting to see a comparative study (probably does not exist) for 2.5 vs 5 mg daily.

[lespleen]

what about dependance? is there any risk of not being able to establish a firm erection without the aid of cialis after prolonged low dosage use???

[ronners]

Cialis helps to inhibits an enzyme in your body that would otherwise cause blood to leave the erection - like viagra and the other PDE5 inhibitors, because it is simply blocking the action of a chemical produced by your body and it is not introducing or increasing the levels of a particular chemical into your body, user's are not at risk of becoming physically dependant on it.

Psychologically people may come to rely on it but personally I have found the drug to be very helpful - it's not as intense as viagra, doesn't have the same side effects and it has a much longer half life (i.e. it takes longer for the body to break it down) hence the fact that it is the only ED drug that is approved for daily use as it builds up in your system as you take it day by day.

[Humorous3]

Do any of you have a link to the Cialis study you're referring to?  It sounds like an interesting read.  Thanks.

Humorous

[restore]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21324095

One thing to keep in mind about this study, none of these men had palpable scar tissue.  But the improvements they achieved in erection quality is encouraging.

[hornman]

You have to wonder about some of these studies.  69% showed improvement?  I seriously doubt it.  Just reading this board tells you that very few see improvement of any kind no matter what the treatment.  Sorry for the negativity.  That's just how I see it.

Hornman

[fubar]

Hornman

Whether or not cialis will straighten a Peyronie's penis is yet to be seen by any of us .Cialis does do what it is made to do though and does help keep your unit healthy.By getting the blood down there and helping those who are not having night time erections.

Cialis and pentox have helped my flaccid state greatly.Adding ubiquinol has made a tremendous difference. My flaccid state elasticity has improved alot no more tight non moving weeny.

I would not worry about seeming negative as we all have those feelings about this condition.I know I have them often and often express them through pm's and the forum.That is what its for to share knowledge and vent.

Fubar

[YMENOW]

I thought being on 7.5 mgs of coumadin every day for my heart would "thin" the blood enough so that there would be plenty of blood going down to the penis....but I was mistaken.  Having read many posts about Cialis in the forum, I asked  my internist about Cialis.  He  told me that Cialis acts differently with the blood as far as "thinning the blood goes".  Since he prescribed Viagra before, he advised me not to mix them.

The Cialis was more than I needed everyday, since I had many early morning erections, I didn't know what to do with.  My wife told me I could poke her anytime in the morning but then she didn't like it at 4 am.  The erections kept me up most of the morning.

Finally, I decided to take them every other day, and now I take them about twice a week.  There is no problem with getting erections, and I believe that viagra would induce a harder more firmer erection than the cialis.

The only thing that really hang are my balls.  I got a set back since I stopped using the VED for awhile.....

The 2.5 is good therapy and you have to find out for yourself what works best for you.

ym

[crashbandit]

I don't have ED but am using Cialis for the healing properties. I popped my first 2.5mg today and like it so far. My flaccid penis is already a nicer hang and the blood flow is great. My question is whether I should take 2.5 mg daily or maybe every second day?

Would 2.5mg daily be too much for a non ED person? I guess I could always test out the 2.5 mg daily and see if I like it.

For all you americans, you can get a free trial period for cialis. go to the cialis home website, http://voucher.cialis.com/index.cfm. Just print off the voucher and take it with your prescription to the pharmacist.

I hope to see reduction of pain with Cialis soon.

[Luciano]

Most studies say, that cialis for therapeuthic usage in Peyronies Disease, is dosed at 5mg/day
(for ED or for sexual enhancement cialis comes in 20mg doses that last for like 36 hours)

[crashbandit]

Anybody notice Cialis lose it's potency after awhile? I've noticed this in the past with Trazodone. Trazodone would give great nightly erections but after a months time, these effects would wear off. Any long term cialis users notice this at all?

[crashbandit]

I have been on a short course of low-dose Cialis for 4 weeks now as part of my post-surgery treatment. I had tried full-strength Levitra when I wasn't having any erections after the surgery - and the stuff made me too sick. The low-dose Cialis, which is taken every day, had a couple of nasty side effects the first week and a half, and then settled down. What it has revealed is that there is nothing wrong with my libido, and I expect I will have very little trouble with ED after the 6 weeks are over. I didn't really care for the side effects much - initially I had stomach upset and crashing headaches, but the only one I am left with is a tendency to have a hot, dry face. For 6 weeks, I can live with that. And my doctor was a brick - the Cialis low-dose samples come in 2-week packages, so I do not have to pay for a prescription unless I want to continue beyond the initial therapy period.

I have not had any evidence of priapism with this approach - but then, I was never much prone to nocturnal erections or emissions.

Ditto on the crashing headaches and lower back pains. I havn't been feeling to well overall since starting Cialis. I hope they stop after a couple weeks like you guys.

[crashbandit]

I found a website online that is a much better deal for Cialis then at my pharmacist. It is:

https://ph-u.com/buy-cialis-usa.html

Anyone use these guys? I ask where the Cialis is made and they said India. I asked them if the factories are under the same regulations as they are in the States and they said yes. I pay $2.50 for a 2.5mg dose from my pharmacist, which translates to $70 a month. Through that website, I could pay 20mg pills x 60 for $155 (plus $10 shipping), which translates into 480 days of 2.5mg doses. Obviously the india supply is much cheaper.

Is the Tadalafil from India good? I don't think it would be any less effective or different then the USA stuff. Maybe there is another website that is alittle more expensive but the Cialis is made in the USA?

[fubar]

Crash

Yes,cialis from India works! Good stuff can not tell the difference from the USA.?

Fubar  

[crashbandit]

Thanks Fubar, I'm gonna do it. I have an awesome drug plan that covers everything, but still they don't cover ED treatments for some reason. Do any drug plans cover ED drugs?

[fubar]

Crash

No, They know men will pay to have a quality erection.I. have great insurance I paid 185.00$ for heart surgery and a three day stay in a hospital.10 pill of cialis 240. 00$ I would have to pay 197.00$.Go figure guess its their way of keeping the population down and not passing on defect genetics.Cost me more for ten erections than to employ a heart surgeon and all the other stuff that goes along with having a failing heart?

Fubar

[fubar]

Mike

From what I have heard priapism is extreamly painful.As long as you are not taking viagra you will be fine.That is the beauty of cialis and why it is costly.Erections when you need one.Not like viagra instant erection.So if you take viagra you do not want to be in a public place.ha ha ha

Fubar

[crashbandit]

I've been taking low dose Cialis (2.5mg daily) and I also have bigtime nightly erections. I've been on Cialis for about a week and I'm very happy so far. My pain has been getting a lot better and the daily better flaccid hang feels great and I think help reduce the pain as well. I think that as long as your feeling ok and not getting worse then don't worry about priapism.

I was having horrible headaches and muscle pain at first with Cialis but these bad side effects seem to be wavering. Let the good times roll:)