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Author Topic: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet  (Read 2283 times)

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NeoV

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Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« on: June 30, 2017, 04:40:02 AM »



--Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
--
Introduction

Insulin resistance and hyperglycemia (high blood sugar) lead to increased levels of tgf-beta, myostatin, and reactive oxygen species (ROS), and to mitochondrial disorder and fibrosis, all of which are the foundation of Peyronie’s disease. Unsurprisingly. Peyronie’s and Dupuytren's are more common in those with Diabetes, and statin drugs are known to cause Peyronie’s and diabetes while lowering CoQ10 levels. You can be skinny, fit, and muscular and still have insulin resistance, and even the so called “normal” blood sugar levels may be the hidden cause of Peyronie’s disease without regards to the genetic component or injury. It has only been in recent years that diets have been shown to reverse diabetes type 1 and 2, and with Alzheimer's now being called “Diabetes type 3,” and fasting shown to have a great effect against cancer, we have every right to take the role of blood sugar and Peyronie’s as serious as ever. Insulin resistance and the overconsumption of carbs, not fat, is now being established as the leading cause of heart disease and other organ damage, and penis disease should be no exception.
*an explanation of how hyperglycemia leads to fibrosis and a raise in tgf-beta can be seen here.
 
A personal anecdote: At 24 years old, I started to develop Peyronie’s, neuropathy, and tendon pain at the exact same time. At age 30, my nerve pain has become severe, and after recent brain and body scans and extensive blood work, the only finding was “slightly high blood sugar.” I recently got sick and did not eat much of anything for 3 whole weeks, and my nerve pain disappeared and my Peyronie’s looked and felt great. Upon starting a carb heavy diet and stopping CoQ10, my nerve pain came back with a vengeance. Doing some digging around online, it appears that even slightly raised blood sugar levels can damage blood vessels and nerves, while the general guidelines on what is low or high may be completely wrong. Upon re-starting CoQ10 and going mostly ketogenic, my Peyronie’s is doing the best that it has in years and the feeling in my hands and feet are coming back.
 
The Diet
 
Goals - to prevent fibrosis via the below means:
*activate nrf2 pathway (to reduce tgf-beta) -- > decrease tgf-beta and myostatin.
*increase mitochondrial function, improve insulin sensitivity
*decrease reactive oxygen species and inflammation
 
The Base
Ketogenic or low carb diet / fasting
activates nrf2 pathway, significantly improves mitochondrial function, reduces inflammation, restores insulin sensitivity, increases blood viscosity, while fasting states induce scar reduction.
*if followed for a long time these diets cause temporary “physiological insulin resistance” which is nothing like the insulin resistance seen in diabetics, which is “pathological.” The two concepts are actually quite different and the terminology is misleading!
 
CoQ10 - 300 mg / day (reduce tgf-beta, myostatin, restores insulin sensitivity, reduce ROS and fibrosis)
Alpha Lipoic Acid - (reduce tgf-beta, myostatin, restores insulin sensitivity, reduce ROS and fibrosis)
Creatine Monohydrate - 2 - 5g / day - significantly blocks myostatin and boost mitochondrial health
Broccoli and Cabbage -  sulforaphane in these vegetables significantly block myostatin
Caffeine - (a xanthine derivative like pentox that reduces tgf-beta and fibrosis, use within safe limits)
Coffee - Chlorogenic acid reduces fibrosis, ROS,
Green Tea - EGCG blocks myostatin, reduces ROS, fibrosis. Studied at length.
 
Avoid: Refined carbs, sweets, saturated fat from “bad” sources until the final verdict is out.
Do: Exercise, meditate, and drink plenty of water, and keep something on hand to eat if you get low. If you are to eat the “classic” carbs, go for complex or slow digesting carbs.
 
Tips and Warnings
 
Budget and Food Choice
Replace rice, bread, or pasta with cabbage at every meal. Shredded cabbage, meat, and eggs, drenched in olive oil, is a calorie and nutrient dense meal you can always rely on. Go crazy on veggies and buy in bulk frozen. Olive oil is your best friend on a ketogenic or low carb diet. Eggplant is another heavy veggie to go for in place of the classic carbs.
 
When tired or low
Going ketogenic or low carb may cause your blood sugar to drop, making you tired, weak, or feel panic attacks coming on. This can be dangerous, so keep something handy to eat just in case. However, avoid going back to heavy carbs. Instead drink a glass of whole milk, eat some veggies or fruit. The goal is to stay low, get used to being low, and teach your body how to run again. This may take some trial and error. Some supplements, drugs, herbal teas, and alcohol, may overly lower your blood sugar, so be careful. Counter-intuitively, eating something high carb can cause you to go low thereafter. Aim to find your safe zone.
 
Overconsumption of fats
On a ketogenic or low carb diet, fats will be one of your primary source of energy, allowing you to go into ketosis, but this does not permit you to binge or over do it. Choose healthy fats, and be careful with coconut oil, as it has more saturated fat than butter.
 
Supplement withdrawal (CoQ10, and others)
Upon stopping this supplement, one’s supply will lower below baseline for a short while, possibly even a week. This may be extremely dangerous, and despite no issues ever being documented, I think it’s best to slowly wean yourself off it, instead of suddenly stopping 300mg per day. Your body needs to begin to create the nutrient again. That being said, temporary states of low CoQ10 may not be a real issue, but I still find the idea troubling.
 
**Always consult with a healthcare professional when changing your diet drastically**
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2017, 11:15:39 AM »

I just discovered alpha lipoic acid, be sure to read the dosage warning on that one:
https://examine.com/supplements/alpha-lipoic-acid/
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Paolo

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #2 on: July 03, 2017, 03:17:47 PM »

Guys, for vegetarian lovers ALA can be found in flaxseed, chia seed and hemp.

ALA may increase nerve regeneration rates and be of aid to nervous system injuries, from the symptoms of tingling, burning, and itching.

What makes ALA special is that since it is both water and fat soluble, you are able to absorb it at any time, regardless of what you’re eating or drinking with it, it crosses also the blood brain barrier (BBB) also, one of the few antioxidants to do so.

Taking an ALA supplement once every 3 to 6 hours would be preferable over a higher dose that’s once or twice daily, for example 100mg pill for systemic administration

Morning: 1 pill upon waking
Mid-morning 1 pill
Lunch: 1 pill
Mid-afternoon 1 pill
Dinner: 1 pill
Late evening 1 pill
Total = 600mg

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JayGould

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2017, 06:00:55 PM »

Have you heard about YK-11? It's supposed to be the strongest myostatin inhibitor available. Safety profile unknown however as it is a very new substance.
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2017, 11:39:43 AM »

Quote
YK-11 is a synthetic, steroidal selective androgen receptor modulator (SARM) (...)
The drug has anabolic activity in vitro in C2C12 myoblasts and shows greater potency than dihydrotestosterone (DHT) in this regard.

That just sounds unsafe. I would advise not to try anything like that without the guidance of a clinical andrologist.
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NeoV

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2017, 11:41:25 PM »

Jay, Myostatin is a major driver of fibrosis and a member of the tgf-beta family. Myostatin is found in the Peyronie's penis and plaques (2008 study). I would love to get my hands on some Follistatin, or what you listed. Until then I'll be eating whole eggs, taking creatine, and coq10. Multiple studies show a reversing of fibrosis when Myostatin is blocked.

I may be dreaming, but my scars are softer and my ridges lesser now that I've been taking that supplement combo for a month or so. I also advise anyone to stick to veggie caps. I would love some input on this. Does anyone know which is better in general, veggie caps or soft gels?

Thanks Paolo! One of the only times my nerve pain went away was when I was eating less and taking ALA and CoQ10. I'll be buying it again!
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Paolo

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #6 on: July 05, 2017, 03:17:42 AM »

NeoV, not for the first time your post was most interesting, particularly about Follistatin, to that end I hope the below link interests you somewhat;

https://examine.com/nutrition/does-dark-chocolates-epicatechin-content-promote-muscle-growth/

Dark chocolate should be raw and unprocessed as much as possible, don't drink chocolate with milk as milk peptides ruin its antioxidant effects greatly, it's not that pleasant but I now prefer it that way, you get used to it.

On a separate note I have just started supplementing Broccomax (Broccoli extract).

Thanks for this  :)
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skunkworks

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2017, 07:58:30 AM »

Myostatin is found in the Peyronie's penis and plaques (2008 study).

Could you link to that study?

It's only quite recently that myostatin was proven to be in smooth muscle at all, and only a few papers on it so I'd really like to see that paper.

Edit. Nvm, I could try being non lazy and find it myself: http://www.jsm.jsexmed.org/article/S1743-6095(15)32106-8/fulltext

Interesting read, bloody myofibroblasts at it again.

This study seems to support our daily pde5 recommendation - https://www.nature.com/ijir/journal/vaop/ncurrent/pdf/ijir201722a.pdf?origin=ppub

Stabler67

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2017, 10:12:24 AM »

Hi guys,



I would just like to clarify something, there is no diet that will reverse Type 1 diabetes. Type 1 is acquired as a child and when the pancreas no longer  has the ability to produce insulin. There is no diet that will make it produce insulin again.

Also the Ketogenic diet can be very dangerous if not followed by a physician. this diet has your body using its own fats as energy causing your body to produce/spill ketones in the urine which if not monitored can cause coma and death. Now this is not to say that No one should try it however if you are in this forum it is because you have a weakened immune system and compromising it more could be unwise. So please be careful

Stabler67
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skunkworks

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2017, 12:13:45 PM »

A ketogenic diet or near ketogenic is (in my opinion) one of the most beneficial ways of eating you could follow as a Peyronie's sufferer.

I recall three case studies where type 1 diabetes was reversed in a juvenile with a gluten free diet, eg - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22729336. In an adult, I'd agree, is it almost certainly past the point of dietary intervention with regards to no longer requiring treatment. But you can use diet reduce how much medication you need day by day.

Type 2 diabetes is obviously reversible, quite easily in fact.

The 'dangers' of a ketogenic diet have been hugely exagerrated in the media, usually due to incorrectly conflating ketoacidosis with ketosis. They had been used safely for decades to effectively treat epilepsy before the weight loss and health benefits were rediscovered. Before that, we have many hundreds of thousands of years in which humans lived in a ketogenic state almost every hour they were alive.

The ketogenic state is more natural for the human body than being in a non ketogenic state. Before agriculture we would have been in a ketogenic state for 99.99% of the hours in our lives.

For 99.4% of our existence from homo erectus onward, we have been hunter gatherers and existing in a ketogenic state.

The best diet you can eat will be eggs, grass fed beef and wild caught fish, with vegetables as a small side.

Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2017, 01:39:03 PM »

The best diet you can eat will be eggs, grass fed beef and wild caught fish, with vegetables as a small side.

The best diet you can get is a diverse mix of unprocessed foods, tackling all the necessary minerals, vitamins, proteins and fats your body needs. We have a bit evolved from our ancestors in terms of energy consumption :) Other than that, totally agree. Ketogenic diet felt great. You don't have to go full scale no-carb. There are several approaches available with low-carb that work to keep you in a mostly ketogenic state.
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NeoV

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2017, 10:36:13 AM »

Sorry for not providing that study. It is interesting that tgf-beta gets attention and not myostatin, which IS part of the tgf-beta family, and is clearly linked to fibrosis and other issues.

Indeed, as Stabler has said, always be careful when changing your diet and consult a doctor.

When I go low carb I can feel very sick and have panic attacks and nearly pass out. I was never like this until recently, but now heavy carb meals cause this as well. I assume that's because my blood sugar crashes. Now that I eat very low carb and high fat, I don't have panic attacks. If I do go too low, I will eat something a bit sweet and even bough glucose tablets. Experiment and always keep something to eat on hand. If you have Peyronie's, chances are you HAVE some blood glucose issues as well.

I do agree that humans are not meant to eat many carbs, like any other animal. I appreciate the comment Skunkworks!
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skunkworks

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2017, 12:30:18 AM »

It would be VERY interesting to see HbA1c results for a big section of Peyronie's sufferers.

And yeah, you can quibble about the minutae of diet endlessly. As long as processed sugars and grains are gone and carbs are low, you'll be doing way better than most.

Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2017, 12:52:54 AM »

They did HbA1c during my active phase. I even had the whole expensive blood work done, because that was a prequisite for therapy. It was normal. The only values off were VitD, which was on the lower end of the scale and uric acid a bit high, but still not in range of gout.
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Paolo

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2017, 04:01:21 AM »

Tychy, Your Vitamin D comment is interesting

Transforming growth factor beta-1 (TGF-β1) plays a major role in the pathogenesis of Peyronie's disease (Peyronies Disease). Vitamin D modulates the profibrotic effects of TGF-β1, as shown in recent studies. Therefore, vitamin D deficiency might be a contributing factor in the pathogenesis of Peyronies Disease

I will have to research this more, i.e. toxic dosage etc, thanks  :)
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NeoV

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2017, 06:32:21 AM »

Tychy, I wonder what "normal" was for the HbA1c. I ask this because from what I read, the standard "normal" is basically already causing damage to your organs. On the extreme side, Dr. Bernstein, says you need a HbA1c of 4.2 to 4.6 or you'll be causing damage.
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Crooked_Stick

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2017, 11:10:13 AM »

my HA1C was 5.7 (pre-diabetic) during the active phase...also my vitamin D was at the bottom of the normal range and my T was low, all pre-conditions for Peyronies Disease
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NeoV

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2017, 11:49:26 PM »

That's great info Crooked.

My ha1c was only 5.3 earlier this year, with 114 blood sugar, which I believe was fasting, in which case it is very much pre-diabetic. I broke my ketosis yesterday and immediately felt sick with a reactive hypoglycemic episode. I felt dread and panic for hours afterwards and my face and tongue went numb.

I have to say, I am very happy I now know the cause of my nerve pain and numbness, AND my panic attacks. It was never a panic disorder, it was merely an issue or problem with blood sugar. For years I spiked it and let it drop too low.
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2017, 03:36:58 AM »

Now this is interesting! I was obviously referring to lab reference ranges. Do you have a study or something for me to read? As you've provoked it, have my lab sheet :)

Name:  Value (Reference Range)

HbA1c: 5.1% (4-6)
HbA1c: 32 mmol/mol (20 - 42)

TSH: 0.73 mIE/ml (0.3 - 4.2)
FT3: 4.08 Dmol/l (3.3 - 6)
FT4: 12.7 Dmol/l (7 - 21.1)
TPO-AK: 1.1 IU/ml (0-35) (No Hashimoto)
TRAK: <0.1 IU/ml (0-0.1) (No Morbus Basedow)
Parathormone: 39.7 pg/ml (12-88)
ACTH: 11.5 ng/l (5-60) (Seems I'm not under chronic stress, well...)
Total protein: 6.86 g/dl (6.6-8.3)
GOT: 23 U/l (0-50)
GPT: 24.6 U/l (0-50)
GGT: 17.4 U/l (0-54.9)
Alkaline Phosphatase: 56.9 U/l (30-120)
LDH: 173 U/l (208-378) (Significant for cell turnover (death). It's lower than reference, which means less cells are dying than usual? I suppose that's good)
Bilirubin: 0.57 mg/dl (0-1.19)
Creatinine: 0.93 mg/dl (0.72-1.18)
Uric acid: 7.76 mg/dl (0-7) (I have occasional pain in my hallux and was thinking about gout, but treatment-worthy is 8 or above)
Inorganic Phosphates: 3.09 mg/dl (2.6-4.5)
Iron: 83 µg/dl (70-180)
Calcium: 2.48 mmol/l (2.2-2.65)
Potassium: 4.42 mmol/l (3.5-5.1)
Natrium: 140 mmol/l (135-145)
Magnesium: 0.78 mmol/l (0.73-1.06)
Haemoglobin: 15.4 g/dl (13.5-17.8 )
Erythrocytes: 4.9 M/µl (4.4-5.93)
HKT: 0.45 I/l (0.47-0.53) (I just saw this. Low HKT and iron, though not clinical significant, is sign of Anemia. Ery also in low range )
HBE: 31.5 pg (28-33)
MCV: 92.5 fl (80-96)
MCHC: 34 g/dl (33-36)
Leucocytes: 5.4 k/µl (3.9 - 10.9) (stopping smoking helps! this was usually up to 9)
Thrombocytes: 314 k/µl (140-330)
Vit-D-25-OH: 23.5 ng/ml (30-100) (I did supplement D3 5000 IU once daily for a month after the test)
Folic acid: 6.2 ng/ml (4-20)
Vitamin-B12: 352 pg/ml (180-914)
Ferritin: 43.1 ng/ml (20-200) (well, look. It's also low)
Luthenizing hormone: 2.21 U/l (4-10)
FSH: 5.64 U/l (1.27-19.3)
Estradiol: 23 pg/ml (0-50)
Prolactine: 5.1 ng/ml (5-15)
Testosterone: 3.81 ng/ml (2.7-10.7) (I've asked my uro about this. You'd want to test receptor activity, as low T may be well bound. It's basically different for everyone)
Inhibin_B: 161 ng/l (25-325)
SHBG: 44.7 (13.2-89.5)
Free androgen index: 29.5 (15-95)
Cortisol: 88 ng/mg (50-250)

...and be sure, I'll NEVER type this off this sheet again :P
I suppose my wheat allergy is/was causing malabsorption
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2017, 04:26:31 AM »

@Paolo:
This was one of the reasons to think about Ehlers-Danlos-Syndrome...Hypermobility and vascular type has mutations on genes that is relevant for TGF-β1 (COL3A1 to be specific, TNXB). And it would fit with the other symptoms:
https://omim.org/entry/130020
Quote
Overall, those with classic EDS and TNX-deficient EDS reported the most neuromuscular involvement, with muscle weakness, hypotonia, myalgia, easy fatigability, and intermittent paresthesias, although patients in all groups reported these features. Physical examination showed mild to moderate muscle weakness (85%) and reduction of vibration sense (60%) across all groups. Nerve conduction studies demonstrated axonal polyneuropathy in 5 (13%) of 39 patients. Needle electromyography showed myopathic EMG features in 9 (26%) and a mixed neurogenic-myopathic pattern in 21 (60%) of 35 patients. Muscle ultrasound showed increased echo intensity in 19 (48%) and atrophy in 20 (50%) of 40 patients. Mild myopathic features were seen on muscle biopsy of 5 (28%) of 18 patients. Patients with the hypermobility type EDS caused by TNXB haploinsufficiency were least affected. Voermans et al. (2009) postulated that abnormalities in muscle or nerve extracellular matrix may underlie these findings.

I've bolded the things that I'm currently or transiently having.

My mother has expressed some of the same symptoms, especially low blood pressure and she's now in her 60s. As Ehlers-Danlos is always inherited without mutating (Type 3 will always pass down type 3), type IV is unlikely for me. Life expectancy with type IV is 34 for men and 37 for women.
I do have a tendency for bruises and my mother once had a chiropractic treatment where her whole right shoulder was blue from rupturing a blood vessel.....I have to get this on the list to be diagnosed, though I know what my doc is going to say....
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Paolo

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #20 on: July 17, 2017, 09:57:16 AM »

Tychy, that must have taken some time to type  :P

Did you get your lab tests done privately, or was that through your medical provider?
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #21 on: July 17, 2017, 01:22:13 PM »

You bet, I was late at work xD

This was done through my medical provider as part of the exclusion protocol. I'm basically tired all the time and hypogonadism was one of the possible explanations, so I got looked at by an endocrinologist. Things still in the pipeline are cardiac valvular defect (unlikely) and EDS (yay, got my referral today...waiting time like 2 months or so?).

Did a quick glucose test: 108 after coffee with milk on empty stomach, 98 two hours after lunch. I think that's fairly normal. I'd start to worry around 125 and panic at 140.

What's happening in EDS is actually that the baroreceptor is malfunctioning, so the body does not counter low blood volume and will not properly constrict the blood vessels in your legs when standing. So blood pools in your legs. It will then increase heart rate to supply enough oxygen to the brain, by pushing out stress hormones that can lead to panic attacks. In worst case you have a syncope. Also your kidneys will just drop fluid and salt out of your system, because "everything is fine", leading to dehydration.
I don't have hunger and thirst. Thirst is the baroreceptor. I think there is something similar in the stomach for hunger.

Time will tell. Maybe it's just a genetic dysautonomia. Treatment would be a seven-days-a-week excercise protocol, which I'm actually fine with by now...

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Paolo

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #22 on: July 17, 2017, 02:15:34 PM »

Thanks Tychy, I myself have had episodes of PAD (Peripheral Artery Disease) that admittedly I self diagnosed but haven't had symptoms (pain walking that is progressive) for more than 18 months  :-\, think diet and supplements have helped with that  :-\. I used to indoor row a lot, bizarrely exercise seemed to make PAD worse in my case.

If the PAD comes back then I am definitely going to try Pentox as I believe it specifically helps with PAD.

Blood pooling in you legs sounds bad, hope you find a treatment for it, take care  :)
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #23 on: July 18, 2017, 03:41:01 AM »

Huh, be sure to get that checked out at some point. PAD and arteriosclerosis are no fun, if blood vessels in your brain are become involved.

Blood pooling in legs and hands is not that bad. I'm used to it. It feels pressury. No black legs or something like that :D
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Tychy

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #24 on: July 20, 2017, 11:06:16 AM »

I'll leave this study here, as it's revelant to the topic
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00394-016-1199-8
(Probiotics and insulin)
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skunkworks

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #25 on: July 20, 2017, 11:52:22 AM »

Quote
Conclusion

Probiotics modestly improved HbA1c and fasting insulin in people with type 2 diabetes.

Paolo

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #26 on: July 20, 2017, 02:33:57 PM »

I take probiotics and have done so for some months, so guess that's a good thing in this respect  ;D

Although I am not diabetic its all good  :)
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skunkworks

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Re: Diabetes of the Penis: Peyronie's and Diet
« Reply #27 on: October 09, 2017, 11:24:39 PM »

Sorry for not providing that study. It is interesting that tgf-beta gets attention and not myostatin, which IS part of the tgf-beta family, and is clearly linked to fibrosis and other issues.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6A9bbDI6fo

Human Myostatin Knock-Out Targeting CRISPR-Cas9 Plasmid - The ODIN
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