PE (enlargement) with Peyronies Disease

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Sir Bando

Note From Staff - Jelqing is extremely dangerous for anyone with Peyronie's symptoms.

Hello all -

I've spent hours reading this forum before I registered. Grateful for this community and all the contributions. I wish I had found it before I started treatments for my Peyronies Disease but my my condition is stable and I've had modest improvement.

My earliest symptoms can be traced back about 18 months, diagnosed about 12 months ago, and started VI in September. At that time I had done nothing to address my worsening dorsal bend just above the midpoint, probably about 75 degrees. Also some loss of girth at the base, loss of length etc. One way I was fortunate was eq has been fairly unaffected. At 52 my eq has decreased even prior to Peyronies Disease, so I dabbled with Viagra/Cialis but saw some downsides to those, so I'm trying to achieve recovery from those drugs and to naturally become more healthy.

Regarding natural supplements, I believe they helped me get good results from the VI. About half way through the treatment I began taking supplements to just generally support collagen health. The products I took were marketed towards healthy skin, hair and nails, for beauty, and to some degree marketed towards women (pink packaging, product placement, etc). The main components were hyaluronic acid with vit C and a mix of dried mushrooms, including cordyceps and reishi. In the end, my urologist said he was quite amazed at the reduction in plaque size, the best he had seen after treating dozens of men over several years.

At the time I started VI, my insurance did NOT cover Xiaflex and there were no urologists in my network of doctors (or in my city) that provide that therapy. A few months after finishing VI I checked back and found my insurance does now cover it, and I located a doctor only an hour away. So I will now be starting that in a month or two.

In the past I used to dabble with and research PE, penis enlargement. I never really stuck with it to get actual gains. There were some times that I did get some vague and general benefits such as overall penis health, erection quality, confidence boost, etc, especially when my PE goals motivated me to make other healthy lifestyle choices such as quitting smoking, getting good supplments, etc.

It was actually during a period of renewed interest in PE that caused me to pay attention to my penis health, and I caught the disease earlier than I might have if I weren't starting a PE program. When I got the diagnosis, my first instinct and decision and action was to cease all PE. During the VI, around the time I began researching and taking the above mentioned supplements, I learned about Xiaflex and the "modeling" regimen and noted how it is like a much milder version of PE. Much, much milder, to be fair, but it's still the idea of manually manipulating and exercising and guiding the shape and health of the penis.

Now I learn on this forum that traction, VED and other forms of modeling (beyond the overly conservative recommendations made by CCH manufacturers) are being used for the treatment of Peyronies Disease. Eventually it's one of my goals here to find/start a conversation about the overlap of Peyronies Disease treatments and exercises done for the purpose of PE.

Here's where I'm at right now. I'm slightly delaying the start of my Xiaflex treatment because I want to condition my penis as best I can. In the PE community one of the fundamental pieces of advice is this: the first few months of PE are mild to moderate exercise, not to achieve gains but rather to condition the penis for the start of slightly more aggressive exercises which could lead to gains. So that's what I'm doing now. I'm doing a mild but very consistent regimen of jelqing; a mild but very consistent regimen of pumping; and a mild but very consitent regimen of traction; and a reasonable amount of very natural supplementation (amino acids, cistanche, very small amounts of maca and yohimbe, etc).

If nothing else I will start off the Xiaflex treatments in a condition of the highest possible natural and safe level of penis health that I'm able to achieve. My hope for the future is to continue a reasonable level of VED and traction during and after Xiaflex, to restore my penis health and size to what it was before Peyronies Disease, and to continue PE to evemtually increase the size to larger than it was before Peyronies Disease

sonnyjim

Hi mate,

I would not recommend penis enlargement to anyone if you are talking about jelqing or stretching etc... This is what I believe caused the formation of scar tissue on my penis and I've lost length and girth. Had I of not read up on penis enlargement I wouldn't be here now. suffering.
33yo, single
severe ed caused by injury to cs, soft glans, lack of sensation
penile implant: ams lgx 700

popopo

Word. Don't do it or suffer the consequences. Yeah, I hated being average and not BIG too, but now size doesn't matter cause I can't work what I have anyway.. oh the irony. Hope you make a better choice than me.
Age: 25
Date of onset: 17
Symptoms: sharp pains, numbness, change in shape/size, hourglassing and discolaration from jelqing/VED usage as a teen. Diagnosed with a venous leak and possible scarring.
Treatments tried: cialis, pentox and VED didnt help

Sir Bando

To both: I hear ya. I'm pretty sure my Peyronies Disease originated from PE activity which I had done INCORRECTLY. I failed to heed the advice of the more experienced PE mentors. I went too hard too fast. Most likely it was from having too much fun with a pump. A poorly made, ill-fitting porn shop novelty item. I pumped too hard for too long on a couple occasions. It worked, I had fun on that particular night. I didn't have any negative symptoms until many years later. But the location of the condition leads me to believe it may have been the pumping.

In any case, as of now my regimen is either having no effect on the Peyronies Disease I have now (because it may have stabilized on its own), or it has stopped the progression, and there's a slight chance that I'm beginning to see some improvement.

Two things I'm certain of right now:

1) what I'm doing is NOT making my Peyronies Disease worse

2) I'm getting very significant improvement of eq and general penis health

Some of the eq improvement is very likely due to a couple unorthodox supplements: He Shou Wu aka Fo-Ti; Cistanche and schisandra (two individual herbs that complement each other); and for erection endurance (which had decreased due to age and abuse of sildenafil) I drink Korean black raspberry wine called bokbunja which is fermented rubus coreanus.

One of the main principles of PE is to not allow turtling. Keep the penis extended. You stress and stretch the tissue, then keep it extended. If the tissue (in our case we're mainly discussing the collagen of the tunica) is shrunk while healing is occurring, then of course the penis will be subject to the possibility of getting smaller. There could be a safe and effective way for Peyronies Disease patients to give consideration to that principle. After modeling, give the penis a gentle wrap that helps hold it in a stretched position, rather than letting it retract into a shrunken position.

Again, once I start Xiaflex I will do the exercises the doctor recommends, which are already similar to my current PE regimen. Then I will continue also with VED and traction, which others have safely used to address their Peyronies Disease. I will be doing just a little bit more than the exercises the doctor will give me, which I'm sure will be pretty darn conservative. I'm only going to be a tiny bit more aggressive. But keep in mind that my exercise/modeling regimen during Xiaflex will be much milder than what I'm doing now, and I'll be working with a penis that has spent the last several months being gently, increasingly, gradually and safely conditioned to thrive and even improve under a firm and consistent routine.

I appreciate the concern and warnings. I'm more mature now, with better motivation, better discretion and discernment, stronger discipline and a more accurate calibration of caution/effectiveness. I'll keep you all posted.

Sir Bando

Update: I continue a reasonable yet aggressive, safe and effective regimen of PE. Pretty much what I should have done from the beginning. First the bad news. I went for about a week of being just ever so slightly too aggressive with an "all day stretch" (ADS) device. I didn't do horribly wrong, but the "pull" was a bit too much. In the end there was no damage, no injury, no worsening. Part of the problem is the device I was using had to be adjusted often, sometimes more often than I could get to a place to adjust it. So I would get it set up just right, and maybe an hour later it would feel uncomfortable and instead of fixing it immediately it would take me half hour or hour to finally reduce the strain. All this meant was that I had to take a few days off or at least only doing very mild exercises. With PE you have to be consistent or you lose progress very quickly.

It's only been two months of what I would consider to be a true PE regimen. For a couple months prior I was very, very, very gradually building up to a regimen. In the first stages it was all about applying a little heat, massaging, very gentle stretching, etc. Like going through the routine but at such a mild level that it couldn't possibly have any benefit. It would be like going to the gym, finding a weight that you could easily curl 100 times nonstop, and then for a couple months only doing three sets of 20. Then doing two sets of 40 and then eventually one set of 120.

I can tell I'm at the bare beginning stages of what would be true size increase. In a way the bend is slightly more noticeable because the inner bend cannot grow at all but the outer bend can. I definitely cannot gain any length but the girth has nudged its way up by the smallest amount. Now I will just hold this routine, not trying to increase the rate of gain, just holding onto and cementing the gains. Keep the penis in that condition of maximum health and ready to grow.

Once I get the Xiaflex shot I will experiment to discover the maximum yet conservatively safe level of modeling/PE. It certainly will be less than what I'm doing now, but hopefully more improvement than most would get when they do the shot and modeling only without PE. When I feel I've recovered adequately from the shot I will very gradually resume the standard PE regimen.

My goals aren't to try to grow beyond a ridiculous level. Step one is to simply return to my original natural size prior to Peyronie's and then if possible, why not, go just a bit beyond. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it.

Here's my bottom line. At the time I get the shot, I want the plaque broken up and new collagen healing to occur in a penis that's robust and capable of growth, so that the newly healed collagen grows along with the PE regimen

Sir Bando

Oops I forgot a couple major points. When I first started using traction and ved, the amount of pressure I could apply was pretty small. For example, when I first used the ved I was gradually increasing the pressure, got up to about 75% and it got real uncomfortable real fast and I fumbled releasing the pressure and it ended up causing a bit of temporary pain. No damage, but dang, ow. Same with the traction, I could only go with low pressure for 2 or 3 hours before needing a break.

Now I can hold the pump at 80% pressure for 10 minutes and it feels fantastic. I can wear the traction ADS device at full pressure for 5 or 6 hours (with a few ten minute breaks), then leave it off for an hour or two, then put it back on again so that I'm wearing it more than 8 hours total for 5 or 6 days per week.

This is basically the progress I wanted to make prior to the Xiaflex shot

skunkworks

Anyone with Peyronie's should do zero jelqing of any frequency/intensity. None at all whatsoever.  
This is an emotionally destructive condition, we all have it, let's be nice to each other.

Review of current treatment options by Levine and Sherer]

Reascot

[Use the 'Reply' link instead of the 'Quote' link - Forum rules]

Hi Sir Brando,

I was wondering which traction device you are using.