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Author Topic: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?  (Read 4990 times)

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Fubar Penis

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Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« on: December 06, 2014, 07:36:03 AM »

Does anyone know if any actual cases, personally, of spontaneous healing of this disease? I keep seeing these numbers that always vary thrown around. I'll see 5 percent on one urology site and then 10 to 12 percent on another, and 50 percent on another. Our disease is so d*&n misunderstood, that not even professionals can give us a straight reliable answer on  statistics or effective treatments. Has anyone heard of someone with a mild, moderate, or even severe case of peyronie's going away after a period of time? Anyone on this site experience the healing first hand? I was assume a lot of people that had experienced spontaneous healing might not be posting anymore, but who knows. I, like all of us, just want to wake up from this nightmare that never wants to end. I pray for this to be over everyday, in hopes that a higher power decides to heal me and my fellow sufferers.
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lonelyboy

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2014, 11:44:54 AM »

One of the guys I worked closely with, his peyronies went away without treatment, I can't remember how long he said but I have the feeling it wasn't a long time. I would think that most people who's peyronies heals without treatment within a short while wouldn't seek out a forum on it, so probably the majority of us on here have waited a while and aren't likely to spontaneously heal.
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james1947

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2014, 04:53:34 PM »

I will second  lonelyboy.
Didn't seems that a long time Peyronies will just go alone and if gone in early stages people will not be here.

James
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Jonbinspain

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2014, 02:12:48 AM »

There are reported cases of spontaneous resolution of the disease. However, they are rare.

One of the most frustrating things about Peyronies is that there are no guaranteed treatments or remedies. What works for one guy, doesn't for another. It's really a matter of finding what works best for you.
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NeoV

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2014, 06:58:31 AM »

It would be naive to think that any study was or is comprehensive enough to detect a true "remission" of Peyronie's. Scar tissue replaces healthy tissue, and I do not see any way besides using stem cells to restore this lost or damaged tissue. Secondly, no standardized technique exists to accurately measure the damage. One man's Peyronie's vastly differs from another's.

An old study found that nearly one QUARTER of dead bodies had "penile scarring". All body builders undoubtedly have scarring on their elbows, whether it causes dysfunction is another question. Peyronie's however affects the shape of the penis which we tend to worry about. Sex is to the penis as bench pressing is to the elbows--Perfectly natural, yet naturally destructive as wear and tear is a reality of life.

At the same time, we have every reason to believe that one can greatly recover from the disease or have significant improvements.

liber

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2014, 08:35:39 AM »

neov

you are assuming damage inflicted, those of us who have peyronie's due to a genetic disposition has no comparison with wear and tear and body builders elbows.
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NeoV

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2014, 08:45:33 AM »

I have to disagree with you there,

Even those who are genetically predisposed (including myself) have the disease triggered by micro trauma of some kind. At least this is my own personal opinion and this is not completely backed by studies on Peyronie's. This is how Dupuytren's is viewed. Genetics plus repeated strain.

You make a good point though. To each his own! : )

liber

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2014, 09:16:13 AM »

and i have to disagree with you.

it is your personal opinion, as i suffer with peyronie's, ledderhose, knuckle pads and dupytrens i can tell you in my case it has nothing to do with 'reapeated strain'.
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NeoV

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2014, 09:27:48 AM »

Good to know, thanks for the clarification liber. My mistake then.

liber

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2014, 09:46:11 AM »

apology accepted neov, good to read your very circumspect peyronie's condition is clearing.
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Fubar Penis

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2014, 06:04:41 AM »

Sorry haven't replied in a while. I had another health scare come up recently and and it was more pressing to deal with;but but hopefully I will clear it up soon. I am starting to deal with this emotionally better, now that the pain associated with it is gone. I really think it is the pain aspect of it more than anything that had caused some of my extreme feelings about myself myself and contracting this disease. As I learned from my recent injury, pain can make every alter your perception and attitude toward life. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to continue any kind of treatment toward the disease due to my recent health issue. I've had to stop cold turkey. I had and have pain from my recent health issue. I hope to resume it soon. If any of you celebrate Christmas, I hope you and your families have a wonderful holiday! :-)
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Irish_worried

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2016, 11:50:13 AM »

My peyriones flared up approx 4 months ago. I have a very identifiable plaque about 1/3rd of the way up from base of penis on top. Main symptoms are a narrowing at the base. And a slight indentation that comes and goes above the plaque. No discernable bend. My question is do people think certain types of symptoms clear up better than others. I have zero pain and am on 50mg of viagra twice a week prescribed by my urologist. Because of the viagra it's hard to know what erection quality would be like without it. When I first noticed it erection quality was poor but that may have been psychological. Anyhow guys what do you think are certain symptoms more likely to resolve than others .. happy New year to all by the way
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itsme

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2016, 06:20:20 PM »

I also would like to know that. But start w pentox n vit E for yesterday!!! Vit E for three years n pentox for one to 2,5 years three times daily. Never with empty gut. Levine, lue, lander egydio kuehas or zahalsy for stem cell are the ones most commented here.
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Jonbinspain

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2016, 07:32:07 AM »

Spontaneous resolution of Peyronie's disease, whilst not unheard of, is very rare.

Flare ups are common. You don't say what else your Uro prescribed? Was Viagra it?  I would advise asking for Pentox. You certainly need to attack this more aggressively.

Your indentation is known as hourglassing, it's a classic Peyronies symptom. Look at using traction, VED, or both.
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Irish_worried

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2016, 10:37:03 AM »

I asked about pentox and was told that it really would be of no benefit. My urologist said he was at a urology conference in the states during the summer where peyronies was discussed and that was the common consensus. If things were to stay as they are I'd happily settle for that but I am holding out hope things improve. I'm still perfectly functional sexually. It's annoying so little is known about this condition and there's very little data out there. As someone previously said there's lots of differing data floating around. For now I'm just going to remain positive and monitor things closely.
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Jonbinspain

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2016, 03:50:52 PM »

I think opinion on Pentox is divided. I used it with no imorovement. But then I had calcified plaque. My own urologists opinion is that it may be of help in the active phase, but in the chronic phase it's unlikely to do any good.
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LWillisjr

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2016, 07:49:20 PM »

Levine, lue, lander egydio kuehas or zahalsy for stem cell are the ones most commented here.

Itsme,
You need to get your facts straight. I am pretty sure that Levine doesn't do anything with stem cells yet. I'm not sure that some of the others you quoted do either.
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Les - 10 yrs Peyronies Disease free
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itsme

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2016, 09:12:28 PM »

Just Zahalsky. Maybe it missed a comma there. Sorry.
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Steveo

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2016, 07:12:20 PM »

I believe that Peyronie's can be caused (in those not predisposed to the syndrome) by trauma. Both small and great trauma.  I would call this "acute" peyronie's and would be more likely to spontaneously heal (though it could take years).

However, I believe there are people who are predisposed to fibrosis that can get it (as a true disease) without trauma.  These people have some sort of genetic predisposition to fibrosis and I could see how the body could attack itself in some sort of autoimmune type way and cause scarring throughout the body including the penis.  This would be more of a "chronic" Peyronie's and would be far less likely to spontaneously resolve.

I would separate the scarring itself from the tendency of the body to scar.  The first I would call a "syndrome" and the second I would call a true "disease." 

If you accidentally slam your penis in the car door and it starts to scar and bend, I don't think you have a "disease."  You have mechanical trauma that leads to a syndrome or simple physical reaction from your body.  Like if you slice your hand while cutting a carrot and your hand scars.  That's not really a "disease" process, it's just the body's imperfect wound healing process.

But if you have a body in which fibrosis occurs without trauma, which does happen, then you have a "disease" which could result in the exact same symptoms but through a different mechanism.

I believe there's a continuum between the two above situations. I don't think it's black and white and most men with Peyronie's are probably somewhere between those two extremes.

I remember reading a study showing that penises shrink throughout life due to scarring.  Therefore, it would appear that all men suffer from minor internal penis scarring to some degree.

From Your Penis and Age: Size, Appearance, and Sexual Function
----
"In addition to this apparent shrinkage (which is reversible) the penis tends to undergo an actual (and irreversible) reduction in size. The reduction -- in both length and thickness -- typically isn't dramatic but may be noticeable. "If a man's erect penis is 6 inches long when he is in his 30s, it might be 5 or 5-and-a-half inches when he reaches his 60s or 70s," Goldstein says.

"What causes the penis to shrink? At least two mechanisms are involved. One is the slow deposit of fatty substances (plaques) inside tiny arteries in the penis, which impairs blood flow to the organ. This process, known as atherosclerosis, is the same one that contributes to blockages inside the coronary arteries -- a leading cause of heart attack.

"Goldstein explains that another mechanism involves the gradual buildup of relatively inelastic collagen (scar tissue) within the stretchy fibrous sheath that surrounds the erection chambers. Erections occur when these chambers fill with blood. Blockages within the penile arteries -- and increasingly inelastic chambers -- mean smaller erections."
----

If penile shrinkage over a lifetime is this common, then every man has Peyronie's "disease" to a greater or lesser extent.

That's one reason that I think I'll be using my VED and traction for as long as I live.  The VED especially is like yoga for the penis -- it keeps it loose and limber.  Without it, I think the vast majority of men would see gradual shrinkage of his penis even without major trauma or curvature.

Oldman has been using his VED for literally decades and I would guess he has one of the healthiest "packages" of any guy his age.  Just as someone who has practiced yoga for decades would have healthy joints, ligaments and flexibility far surpassing others his age.
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skunkworks

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2016, 07:47:12 PM »

and i have to disagree with you.

it is your personal opinion, as i suffer with peyronie's, ledderhose, knuckle pads and dupytrens i can tell you in my case it has nothing to do with 'reapeated strain'.

The thing is all those conditions appear in parts of the body that are under repeated strain just through everyday life. Even the penis, through sex or erections while clothed or while sleeping on your stomach etc. 

Laveley

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2016, 01:05:07 PM »

My deceased father supposedly had peyronies with natural remission.

Accordingly to my mom, he had a pronounced bend to one side when he was ins his 50's... he went to the doc which said the usual "wont do nothing about it". After a period of about six months, the bend simply vanished one day... go figure!

I wish i had his luck.

My doc said cases like that are rare, about 10% of the subjects.
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NeoV

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2016, 05:59:25 AM »

Nicely said Steveo.

To respond to Laveley,

These types of resolutions could be cases of inflamed tissue or hematomas, which were mentioned in the recent 2016 report. I am very prone to acute bending which can turn chronic, as in permanent bending and I suspect scar tissue. One report said the inflammation that causes Peyronie's stays trapped between the layers of the tunica for "months," and I would not be surprised if these 'pre-peyronies' bending cases could last a long time, flaring up as the wound is aggravated, finally to heal in time with rest.

In other words, I have reason to believe that bending is not always scar tissue, or always entirely scar tissue. In cases with minimal scarring or mild areas of fibrosis I imagine one could get better nearly back to the way he was.

So we have to wonder then if cases of obvious scarring can simply go away without permanent loss of noticeable penile tissue.

I have no doubt some men "recover" to a functionally and aesthetically "cured" penis. But I have every reason to doubt said penis is an exact copy of the one before symptoms. Not only that, but the disease is so systemic, making one prone to and stemming from other issues such as erectile dysfunction. In this sense Peyronie's can't really be gone, unless you do not have the genetic link, and your bending was not a result of serious scarring. I could imagine a few people make it through the early phases of the disease so long as their bodies aren't going crazy with the overproduction of tgf-beta.

Several studies mention complete resolution of the scar and bending as an outcome for some participants, but you have to keep in mind that with a disease as tricky as this, there is bound to be a percentage of people in any given study who happened to have a good day on follow up examination while the examining doctor forgot which area was scarred with the ultrasound.

With all this said, I could be wrong and take that very seriously. Perhaps scar tissue can simply go away without resulting in any loss of penile tissue. Still, we should take any reports of remission with a grain of salt. Even if it does happen it could mean very little for us who have what Steveo describes as the "disease."

Laveley

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #22 on: March 08, 2016, 12:08:01 AM »

Yeah, but whatever you say, what i said remains; i wish i had this luck.

Also, wouldn't you want to wake up one day with the bend gone, even if your penis wasnt "an exact copy of the one before symptoms"?

Whatever the causes of natural remission are, i wish had it!
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Dared

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #23 on: March 08, 2016, 05:05:22 AM »

I don't think it's possible. Like NeoV said, the spongy tissue is replaced by the scar. Theres no reversing that process.
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Jonbinspain

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #24 on: March 08, 2016, 06:13:21 AM »

We've done this one before. As far as I know, scar tissue, wherever it is on the body is just that - scarred tissue. Once scar tissue, always scar tissue, unless somebody knows differently?
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Perspex

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #25 on: March 08, 2016, 07:13:51 PM »

after an operation on my knee I had scar tissue in various places

I was advised to massage one particular bit after my operation with the aim of breaking it down. Until just now I had forgotten this. I think it didn't really bother me too much so I stopped massaging after 5/6 months.

I've just check where that little lump of scar tissue was ... It's virtually gone. It was a chunk the size of a couple of peas... now its a tiny speck.

Most of that break down has happened without me doing anything. So scar tissue can break down with massage.. and naturally.
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skunkworks

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #26 on: March 08, 2016, 08:08:36 PM »

Scar tissue can resolve, the pentox study on radiation burns showed that. As did the septal scarring study using cialis.

rich68

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #27 on: March 09, 2016, 03:46:19 PM »

Although not a complete healing, this man seems to be saying his plaque (and the bend) has receded a little:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOgJ-18uSm0

(from about 1min30)

I agree that there could be other factors at play though.
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NeoV

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Re: Any urology accounts of actual spontaneous peyronie's healing?
« Reply #28 on: March 09, 2016, 07:08:17 PM »

There are many scientific accounts of healing, reduced bending and reduced plaque size and even plaques disappearing with treatment.

The question is how reliable the accounts of complete remission and plaque disappearances are given their rarity and difficulty to test. Also, if healthy penile tissue can ever replace scar tissue which has never been demonstrated.

Perhaps the penis can heal itself after the scar tissue goes away in time with healthy erections and things like traction and VED. I sure hope so too :)
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